Anyone tested the other Hybrids?

[red1dr]

Originally Posted by ElectricTroy

Technology that is over 100 years old (the NiMH battery is merely the incremental advance of the older NiCad and lead-acid... as is the electric motor merely the final stage of 150 years of gradual process). EVs have been around a long time, and all the insight did was integrate a tiny EV motor where the flywheel used to be. Even the lean-burn engine is merely a 3-cylinder version of the 4-cylinder lean-burn engine used in the 80s and 90s.

It doesn't really impress me that much. Of course, I am electrical engineer... most electronics don't impress me unless they are bleeding-edge.

A pity. So what kind of car do you drive? Do you own an Insight?

[budomove]

Originally Posted by ElectricTroy

Even the lean-burn engine is merely a 3-cylinder version of the 4-cylinder lean-burn engine used in the 80s and 90s.

You are absolutely right, the electrified flywheel design is such a small step toward independence. To clarify, the first lean burn engine was the 1.5 liter d15z1 in the eg civic vx (1992-1995), a really great engine, and a shame it is not used in all civics. The second lean burn engine was in the 1996-2005? civic hx, and was also pretty efficient. I wish they would just continue at least with the hx, which was disconitued because it was competition for the civic hybrid which was like $7000 more, but the same basic efficiency as the 5spd hx. A shame.

[budomove]

Originally Posted by ElectricTroy

Even the lean-burn engine is merely a 3-cylinder version of the 4-cylinder lean-burn engine used in the 80s and 90s.

You are absolutely right, the electrified flywheel design is such a small step toward independence. To clarify, the first lean burn engine was the 1.5 liter d15z1 in the eg civic vx (1992-1995), a really great engine, and a shame it is not used in all civics. The second lean burn engine was in the 1996-2005? civic hx, and was also pretty efficient. I wish they would just continue at least with the hx, which was discontinued because it was competition for the civic hybrid which was like $7000 more, but the same basic efficiency as the 5spd hx. A shame they couldn't bring affordable efficiency to the masses by putting lean burn in all their cars.

[Dgate]

Troy....We were not discussing the history of electric motors or batteries merely the added complication over conventional cars or the difference between the Insight and Prius.
This added complication is what puts some people off the idea of a hybrid and indeed alienates "some" Insight owners from the Prius.

DGate

[ElectricTroy]

Yes I know. And I was explaining why the insight is a "simple" design. It's basically a 3-cylinder Geo Metro with an electric motor added. It doesn't get any simpler than that. In fact, it's simplicity is why I bought it, because I knew the chance of failure was small, (versus a more complicated design).

Lean-burn:

GM made a lean-burn engine in the late 70s and early 80s. That may have been what I was thinking of. In any case, it's not a new idea.

Originally Posted by red1dr

A pity. So what kind of car do you drive? Do you own an Insight?

Of course. I'm actually on my second, but you said the insight is a sophisticated design. From my view, it isn't. Hybrids date back to the 1920s. It's old, old technology that has merely been brought to the modern day. It's simply a standard 3-cylinder car with an electric motor instead of flywheel.

Its simplicity is what makes it elegant.

[red1dr]

Originally Posted by ElectricTroy

but you said the insight is a sophisticated design.

I did? When? Where? Which previous cars used an electric motor for a flywheel? And had an aluminum chassis? And used those special casting techniques?

Most "new" ideas come from a lineage, and most "new" designs combine existing ideas in novel ways, perhaps with new advancement in one of the features.

The F-117 Stealth "fighter" simply combined existing technology of computerized flight controls (to make an unstable shape flyable), laser-guided bombs (so it could use the invisibility of night), a Russian theorist's partial solution of Maxwell's equations for edges so that radar signatures could be calculated for flat faceted structures, and increased computer capacity so that these calculations could be done. Overall a pretty amazing accomplishment that redefined parameters of air warfare, but clearly built on what went before. So just because aspects of a design have been used before doesn't make it boring, at least to me.

Simplicity is good too, but the Insight doesn't seem all that simple, to me anyway. But maybe I'm just easily impressed, and I do enjoy being impressed.