How old is Insight development?

[florida_gators]

I did a search to see if this has already been covered, but I couldn't find anything. If there is, just redirect me

With all the national talk about fuel efficient vehicles hitting the 40-50 MPG mark in 2008, when was the technology for the Insight first developed? I know it first appeared at the Tokyo Auto Show in 1997, so by my uneducated guess the development began about five years before that. Although the Insight does have its limitations, such as being a two-seater, it confuses me as to why auto makers either don't want to or haven't expanded on the 15 year old technology of the Insight and made a four-seater sedan that gets 70-80 MPG in 2008. For all you physics-minded folks, is there something about this expansion that makes it impossible/impractible, or has the mass market just not demanded this type of vehicle yet?

I would understand if the Insight was developed by some private business, but it was produced by a mass manufacturer. An 80 MPG pickup truck sure would be useful to me!

[bryankwalton]

http://www.insightcentral.net/KB/development/index.html

[Dgate]

is there something about this expansion that makes it impossible/impractible, or has the mass market just not demanded this type of vehicle yet?

[Mod - Political statement removed]

DGate

[jat1793]

Well, if you want to go really far back, there is the CARB (California Air and Resources
Board) ZEV (Zero Emmision Vehicle) Mandate. ZEV basically just meant electric vehicles only.

The ZEV Mandate made it so that beginning 1996 EVs must begin to be sold/leased. None were sold, but many were leased, like the Honda EV+. There's very little info available about the Honda EV+. I just checked Wikipedia and the article was updated. I don't think there is anywhere else where you'll find more info about the car!http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_EV_Plus

So, I'd imagine that some of the technology from the Insight was borrowed from the EV+. Both used NiMH batteries. I guess you can call the EV+ the mystical grandfather of the Insight. There is so much information about these great cars lost to time.

I'm waiting for the new Honda hybrid to come out: http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/02/19 ... /#comments

[IamIan]

The larger the vehicle the less aerodynamic it is... generally... it will have a larger frontal area to displace... etc...

every 1% increase in weight = 1% increase in Rolling Resistance...

smaller and 2 seater cars are lighter... it is two for one... you get less air to move and less weight.

The Insight with its Aerodynamics and low weight would be getting in the 50's for MPG without much driver effort and without the Hybrid parts.

The biggest parts that make the Insight able to get its MPG ... prevent any pickup truck that is not a PHEV from ever getting as good.... very few other cars on the road of any price level can match the insight for both aerodynamics and low weight... one or the other maybe... but very few can get both.

Technical improvements have been made... including the addition of low speed EV mode in the latest civic HEVs... but allot of the technical stuff is now chasing the 1% margins.... if you want better Aerodynamics you have to go to a car that looks like the Aptera... weather you like the look or not it is the shape of improved aerodynamics... If you want lighter... you have to stay 1 or two seater and as small or smaller of a car... and use even lighter materials than aluminum... which will make it even more expensive.... Or you go to PHEV and offset the gasoline MPG with kWh.

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Aside from Technical... economically... super fuel sipping cars like the Insight are not what the masses of consumers pay for... for as many Prius as Toyota Makes and sells ... they and Hybrids in general are still a minor part of the Auto-Market / Industry.... especially compared to SUV / Trucks.

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If people cared enough to put cars like the insight in the top sellers of the auto-industry... people would not drive cars... as the rules of size and weight still apply... if it was that important people would walk ... ride bicycles.... take buses... take trains ... personal vehicles like cars would be rare, and not the norm.

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Just my 2 bits.

[Dgate]

florida-gators wrote

it confuses me as to why auto makers either don't want to or haven't expanded on the 15 year old technology of the Insight and made a four-seater sedan that gets 70-80 MPG in 2008.

This gets back to what drives the market,is it the customer? the manufacturer? government policy? world events? or all the above?
One could say while America has indulged in inefficient transport due to cheap gas European governments have increased taxes on gas dictating that cars be more efficient.This Government intervention is a factor like it or not.
Manufacturers try to manipulate the market with advertising aura for their stockholders benefit,ie cheap to build high profit vehicles.
World events have had an immediate affect on the customer while Manufacturers and government in the USA are playing catch up,This is where we are today with high energy costs and few or no efficient vehicles in the US.
Europe has experienced higer prices too but already has 50 to 70 mpg vehicles in the market due to Gov" policy.

I agree with IamIan about the mechanics of an efficient vehicle but there are and always will be other factors influencing your choice of a product not just the inability to build it.

DGate