Is 100mpg/1000mile fillup possible without MIMA?

[azaviator]

I know some of you out there with MIMA have exceeded 100mpg on a full tank (1000 miles or more), but I'm curious if anyone has done it without MIMA.

2.5 years ago, when I got this car, my first tank was 64mpg. My goal at that time was to reach EPA (the original EPA was 70mpg). Two tanks later I reached it, got the hypermiling bug, then made my goal 80mpg. A few tanks (months) later I hit that goal with 808 miles at fillup. Then I raised the goal to 90mpg. This one took a while to crack. I flirted with it on one tank last summer when I got 90.0mpg on the fcd for a run of 861 miles but the actual mpg was 88.2, just shy of the goal(I wouldn't have counted it anyways since I didn't hit 900 miles). 2 weeks ago I finally passed the 90mpg barrier with 94mpg over 937 miles.

Even though I told myself last summer that I would stop at 90mpg, I have set what I am determined will be my last goal: getting 1000 miles on a fillup, with 100mpg actual and on the fcd. My current tank has over 400 miles with 97.5mpg on the fcd. Problem is, I can't seem to get the fcd to increase above that with everything I have tried. (Link to tank data)

In my quest to higher and higher mileage I have: slowed down (a lot), chosen the best route to work and back, installed the Assist/Regen Disable switch, the brake switch mod, and (most recently) an FAS switch. I sweat it out rather than run the A/C. I drive with the windows up whenever possible. I minimize the use of the battery. I keep the tires at 55psi.

My route to work has 11 stoplights over ~6 miles, then ~14 miles of highway, then ~3 more miles of surface street driving with 9 stoplights. I drive the same route back. I am usually able to time the lights so that I only have to stop 3-4 times each way. If I see a stop coming (and I usually do), I will use FAS to coast if the battery doesn't need a charge (rarely does). I go 35-48mph on the surface streets (40-45mph posted) as appropriate to help with timing the lights (the 48mph is at .7 miles from my house, I FAS and coast through 2 lights all the way to the driveway, works well most days). My highway miles are at 50-65mph with a 55-65 posted limit.

Without going even slower, I don't know if there is anything else I can do. Slower would be tough since I already get odd stares from people who pass me or stay behind me. I don't want to push them to the point where they try to show me their displeasure...

The obvious answer is to get MIMA, but I don't have the $$$ or the install knowhow. Plus, I don't think this particular goal is worth THAT much (not to mention that there is something to be said for reaching 100mpg/1000miles without MIMA).

So, ultimately, my questions are:
1) Has anyone reached this goal without MIMA?
2) Can anyone think of other things that I haven't mentioned that may help me eek a few more mpg out to break through this barrier?
3) Should I give up on this goal, lest I be driven insane by the mpg bug?

[satchel]

Has anyone reached the goal without MIMA? How about 2254.4 miles on a tank?

The Insight Marathon 2006 -- World Record 2,254.4 miles on one tank of fuel - CleanMPG Forums

[azaviator]

Yeah, I forgot about that one. I was looking more for some ideas that I could use on my daily drive, since I don't like the idea of wasting miles just to meet my goal. Driving out to the middle of nowhere just to drive around in circles doesn't seem like an effective way to reach my goal.

[satchel]

Agreed. You've got a tough route with that many stops and keeping to 50mph would likely generate some road rage in people. I know the tps mod helps me but wouldn't help you unless you have some stretchs where you can keep it in lean burn. Maybe try 60# in the tires? Radiator block? Hot air intake? You're getting really good numbers as it is and are sure close, alas summer will be over soon and the mpgs won't be so easy.

[red1dr]

I've had a number of >1000 mile tanks (filling only to the first click, you could easily do it by overfilling the tank). But that's with MIMA. However it sounds to me as though you have most of the features of MIMA that I use, excepting only the ability to add in regen at any time.

To some extent your route will determine the mpg you can get. OTOH, the fact that you drive it every day means that you know it extremely well, and can try different variations to see what works.

A relatively short route like that is tough because the low mpg warmup periods drag down your average. A block heater might help, at least in the morning, by shortening your warmup period.

You might also gain something by raising your tire pressures to 65psi. Mine have been there for the past 3 years without any problems. Try it and see if the firmer ride is OK for you. Frankly, I don't notice any bad effects to handling, ride, or braking, but then I'm not pushing the performance envelope of the car.

Slowing to 50mph on the highway portion (or even 45mph if no one is behind you) would probably help as well. But again try it and see how you feel about it. And also be sure it's legal (around here, the posted legal minimum is 40mph in 65mph zones, no minimum in 55mph zones). I too thought it would cause a lot of road rage but in three years of doing it on interstates in CT, MA, NY, NJ it hasn't been a problem. I don't care if people are giving me odd stares (and I don't bother looking at them, why escalate things). Very occasionally I get honked at as they pass me. No point in reacting then either because the honker is ALREADY passing me, speeding up won't help them.

Several tricks:
- help out the semis by hitting your hazard lights for a few cycles when they are still WAY back, so they have plenty of time to ease over a lane, and then flash them back into your lane with your headlights when they are clear of you - this smooths out traffic flow
- stay to the right side of the right lane to be more noticeable (for anyone paying attention)
- pay closer attention to traffic behind you than you would if you were going 80mph and didn't have to worry about faster traffic

Of course, on 2-lane roads with limited passing zones I go the max speed limit (which isn't fast enough for some other drivers).

It takes a while getting used to, but I find that almost nobody bothers me. It's easier for the speeders to whiz off into the distance rather than bother with me and my funny-looking car which they think probably can't go any faster anyway. But if you don't like it don't do it.

One more thing: if you are shooting for a 1000 mile tank, as you approach empty it's a good idea to put a small 1-gallon tank of gas in the bin in the back in case you run out. If you use it just add 1 gallon to your refill number.

[RobertSmalls]

Originally Posted by azaviator

3) Should I give up on this goal, lest I be driven insane by the mpg bug?

Most people would. What are you willing to give up to achieve your 100mpg tank? How slowly would you have to drive, and how much of your time would that consume?

I have a maxim: "60mpg is good enough". If I'm above 60mpg, which is pretty much all the time, then I don't sweat the mileage. Sure, I could push it to 90mpg or higher, but in my analysis, it's not worth the extra time I'd spend in the car, or the aggravation hypermiling causes to other drivers when done in light and moderate traffic.

[red1dr]

Originally Posted by azaviator

3) Should I give up on this goal, lest I be driven insane by the mpg bug?

I don't think you need to worry about that. The people who have done 100mpg tanks (right lane cruiser, highwater, xcel, retepsnikrep, and me to name just a few) seem remarkably sane. OK, perhaps I shouldn't speak to my own sanity.

Nor do you need to worry about people getting upset at hypermiling. In light to moderate traffic, they can easily change lanes and go by you (assuming changing lanes is not too much of a challenge for them). Heavy traffic naturally slows down (this is why "packs" form) which naturally reduces the speed differential between you and them.

But you need to actually TRY it. Many people's objections are based on theoretical grounds of what they think will happen. My experience has been that hypermiling doesn't aggravate other drivers as seriously as one might fear. In fact, while I was slowing down my driving I found that there were more traffic "problems" when I was running 60-65mph in a 65mph zone than running 50-55mph, perhaps because it's less clear to other drivers that you are running slower than them so they have to decide whether to pass you or not. That said, I avoid running under 50mph in a 65mph zone (even though 40mph is legal) because I worry that the speed differential may be too much for too many other drivers to handle. The only times I run under 50mph in a 65 zone is when there is no traffic behind me (speeding up to 50mph, hopefully with the help of a downhill, as traffic approaches from behind) or when climbing a steep hill (mixed in with the semis in the climbing lane). Trying this out for a couple weeks is the only way to find out for yourself.

As for time differentials, I found that the extra 10 minutes on my commute was well worth a more tranquil state of mind after both legs of the commute, plus a far less exhausting trip. Ditto for the extra 20-30 minutes it takes me to get to Boston. But again this is something you have to try for yourself both to see how much longer it takes and to see the effects on you; theoretical objections are meaningless.

The goals you have for your Insight are really your own choice. If you want to average 100mpg for a tank there's nothing wrong with that.

[SPeacock]

Extreme goals call for extreme methods.

Make sure the 'air dam' fiber/rubber protection that cleans up the flow of air from the front bumper to the body undercarriage is in good repair and not hanging down.

Remove passenger seat, storage well liner, and loose some weight then wash the car. There may still be a few wounded bugs still trying to unstick themselves.

[3-Wheeler]

Originally Posted by red1dr

....In fact, while I was slowing down my driving I found that there were more traffic "problems" when I was running 60-65mph in a 65mph zone than running 50-55mph, perhaps because it's less clear to other drivers that you are running slower than them so they have to decide whether to pass you or not......

I have to agree with red1dr completely on this point!!

It does not make any sense to me why, but when I first started hypermiling with a Cavalier I bought a ScanGauge II and had in the car. One morning on the way to work I was driving two mile intervals at different speeds on a two-way road.

At 55 mph the traffic seemed content to either pass or stay comfortably behind me. But the minute I started going 60 mph to check the ScanGauge and gas mileage, the traffic went nuts and everybody was fighting each other, try to get past and outdo the other person.

It was freaky how quickly this happened!!

I even hypermile on the motorcycle, and the traffic seems less inclined to pass when I'm driving slightly under the speed limit. Can't explain it!!

Jim.

[JimGnitecki]

Originally Posted by 3-Wheeler

I even hypermile on the motorcycle, and the traffic seems less inclined to pass when I'm driving slightly under the speed limit. Can't explain it!!

Jim.

Two reasons I can think of:

1. Drivers subconciously tend to "match speeds" with nearby cars, unless those cars are going NOTABLY fatser or slower than they are

2. An astonishingly high percentage of drivers, especially male ones, are "competitive". When you are driving notably slower than they are, no problem - they just whip by you. However, when you are going about the same speed as they are, they want to try hard to "get out front" of you. Silly, but true.

Jim G