hmm, maybe CVCC is a little more specific kind of 'vortex controlled combustion' than what's found on the gen1 insight. No mention of it in that wikipedia article after about 1986. But it sure sounds a lot like lean burn...
Yeah CVCC was not used after 1986. Here is a neat cutaway pic of CVCC.
It's really nothing like lean burn. It's just a cylinder head design they used. Lean burn as I am sure you know is a function of the computer to lean out the A/F at low load. CVCC, was pretty much the predecessor of VTEC, and then VTEC-E, and iVTEC.
CVCC is lean burn. "Honda's engineers at the time, Mr. Date conferred with Mr. Yagi and Mr. Nakagawa about the possibility of creating lean combustion via a prechamber, which some diesel engines utilized"
So, what's the scoop on the move to build the CR-Z? Was that some sort of conscious decision to take the CR-X, 'CR-Y' (1st gen Insight) lineage into a more refined, niche-type direction? I figure, once the 1st gen didn't sell very well, they decided to build a 4 door, 4 seater, and opted to build off of the Insight name recognition. And then, perhaps they thought they could go back to the 2 seater concept if they 'tricked it out' and more or less carved out a niche...
I think their intention was to regain the CRX market, they have lost. In my opinion Honda has lost it's way. The CRZ is destined to be a bit of a failure. It's their platform that they decided to launch their new Sport/Hybrid technology with, and that is all fine and dandy, but they could of made it with more optional trims like back in the CRX days, and it would of sold better. The same thing could be said about the Insight as well. They could have basically offered similar trim levels like they do with the Civic, and it would of been a wild success, much like the old CRX. Instead they made a one size fits all model that is supposed to be a sport Hybrid, and isn't even able to get over a 40mpg epa rating. Deplorable I say. The 88 CRX HF was rated at 51mpg after all.
The CRZ should of been offered as a DX, HF, and Si, just like the CRX. This current trim could of been the DX, they could of made a more fuel efficient version, and strip a bunch of fat out of it, and a more fuel efficient drivetran, maybe at least get it up to G1 Insight ratings, since we know that is possible. Of course there should of been a Si trim, which of course would feature a 200hp K-series engine, which would be a true sport model, and go for that market.
Similarly the G1 Insight would have been so much more if the same thinking was applied to it. Instead all we got was the HF. If they sold what LHT is building the 200hp K-Sight direct from Honda with a warranty, back in 2000. It would have been a huge success. I'm not sure many on this board would want one, but it would of been more successful, than what they did. Instead of just hitting the ultra high gas mileage market, they could of done so much more. If Honda ever figures this out, they might be able to make the CRZ fill the CRX's shoes.
Instead they made a one size fits all model that is supposed to be a sport Hybrid, and isn't even able to get over a 40mpg epa rating. Deplorable I say. The 88 CRX HF was rated at 51mpg after all.
Remember that EPA revised their MPG calculation so the old CRX HF figures would "only" be 41 City/49 Hiway (44 Combined) with the newer formula used after 2008.
CRZ has the porker disadvantage, like all new cars: numerous airbags, ABS/Vehicle stabilty control, Projector headlights, power windows, thicker glass, bigger brakes, better crashworthiness, side impact protection, power mirrors, amplified stereo, bigger speakers etc all add up to weight gains over the spartan early CRXs which weighed less than the Gen 1 Insight.
__________________ Silver 2001 Insight 5spd - #0160
264+K miles
(Has some bruises, needs some stuff...but I still love it.) Citrus w/ A/C - #2083
270+K miles
(Still needs some stuff...but I already love it.)
...CRZ has the porker disadvantage, like all new cars...
Yeah, I was a little astonished at the weight listed at its wikipedia article - 2700 lbs. 1,000 lbs more than the gen 1?? Hard to relate...
To my eye, the CR-Z seems to go overboard on the techno-racer-boy theme; seems like Honda could have made, or could make, some variations, one of which would be toned down, lighter, more economical... Basically, they make the niche too narrow...
I think their intention was to regain the CRX market, they have lost. In my opinion Honda has lost it's way. The CRZ is destined to be a bit of a failure. It's their platform that they decided to launch their new Sport/Hybrid technology with, and that is all fine and dandy, but they could of made it with more optional trims like back in the CRX days, and it would of sold better. The same thing could be said about the Insight as well. They could have basically offered similar trim levels like they do with the Civic, and it would of been a wild success, much like the old CRX. Instead they made a one size fits all model that is supposed to be a sport Hybrid, and isn't even able to get over a 40mpg epa rating. Deplorable I say. The 88 CRX HF was rated at 51mpg after all.
The CRZ should of been offered as a DX, HF, and Si, just like the CRX. This current trim could of been the DX, they could of made a more fuel efficient version, and strip a bunch of fat out of it, and a more fuel efficient drivetran, maybe at least get it up to G1 Insight ratings, since we know that is possible. Of course there should of been a Si trim, which of course would feature a 200hp K-series engine, which would be a true sport model, and go for that market.
Similarly the G1 Insight would have been so much more if the same thinking was applied to it. Instead all we got was the HF. If they sold what LHT is building the 200hp K-Sight direct from Honda with a warranty, back in 2000. It would have been a huge success. I'm not sure many on this board would want one, but it would of been more successful, than what they did. Instead of just hitting the ultra high gas mileage market, they could of done so much more. If Honda ever figures this out, they might be able to make the CRZ fill the CRX's shoes.
This is exactly how I feel. They should have split the CRZ in to HF, DX, and Si. My line would differ slightly than yours.
I would align mine, like the current Civic line is split up.
HF should be a just like it is now (1.5L Hybrid) plus the HF rims from the Civic and underbody aero kit. Make it lighter. Like the Civic Hybrid/HF.
DX should be like a normal Civic with a 1.8L engine.
Si should have the 2.4L K series. (like you suggest)
This is exactly how I feel. They should have split the CRZ in to HF, DX, and Si. My line would differ slightly than yours.
I would align mine, like the current Civic line is split up.
HF should be a just like it is now (1.5L Hybrid) plus the HF rims from the Civic and underbody aero kit. Make it lighter. Like the Civic Hybrid/HF.
DX should be like a normal Civic with a 1.8L engine.
Si should have the 2.4L K series. (like you suggest)
I thought about that approach as well. I just think the current CRZ drivetran would be a letdown to people seeking gas mileage. Especially in comparison to the G1 Insight.
I figure, once the 1st gen didn't sell very well, they decided to build a 4 door, 4 seater, and opted to build off of the Insight name recognition. And then, perhaps they thought they could go back to the 2 seater concept if they 'tricked it out' and more or less carved out a niche...
Here's my best guess (and it's only a guess)
2006 insight discontinued
2007 Honda shows an insight-style prototype that emphasizes power, not MPG. Many thought it would be the Insight II, but I suspect Honda planned it to be the CRZ all along.
2009 The Insight II arrives but it doesn't look like the prototype. It's basically a civic hybrid, but in a 4-seat stretched insight body. I suspect releasing this car was a last-minute decision by Honda. (Too bad they didn't keep the 3 cylinder engine.)
__________________
OWN: 61mpg Insight (greenercars.org score: 57)
both blue and silver,
and a 45mpg BeetleTDI (score: 47).
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