Impact of 'deep' discharge prior to grid charge

[RedJellyBean]

Off-topic post edited and removed. I also fixed my signature too. Don't want to junk up any more threads.

[Hugh-Falls]

Originally Posted by RedJellyBean

I will get in touch shortly about getting one of the DIY setups then! You haven't got any complete component kits available, right?

Gentlemen: Please stay on topic. Please search for appropriate thread or start your own with YOUR topic. Please do not junk up this thread.

[eq1]

That's so funny... 'Off-topic' is the nature of the beast, especially when you have threads like this with long-winded posts like mine...

[Mike Dabrowski 2000]

This is off topic, especially since there are two MIMA threads that can be used.

[RedJellyBean]

Originally Posted by Hugh-Falls

Gentlemen: Please stay on topic. Please search for appropriate thread or start your own with YOUR topic. Please do not junk up this thread.

Understood - loud and clear. I've amended my posts in this thread.

[JohnVirginia]

Originally Posted by joecvt

For my method of discharge, I wired up a four-wire harness with a four prong connector whereas 3 out of 4 prongs on the car side of the harness are female and one male prong. This way, the high voltage prongs on the connector are not sticking out for you or the car to accidentally touch or short out. I also put an inline fuse of only 1 or 2 amps (based on what you can find). The other two wires are setup to power the fan (if you feel it is needed) I put a relay spliced into the positive of the fan wire so that if you attached 12v positive and ground to the other two wires in the four wire connector, it will activate the relay, bypass the car function and send power to the fan. I can also vary the speed of the fan a bit. When there is no 12v power on the connector, the relay defaults to the car driving the fan. I did not put any diodes on the fan or high power connections. That can be done on the other side of the harness. So on the car side, the only male prong is for fan 12v negative so it seems like a safe method.

For the high voltage side, one goes the black cable (ground side) on top of the battery and the other goes down lower into the battery case (below the contact relay) so it is hot at all times. I have the inline fuse on the positive side.

The four prong connector can only be connected one way so there are no mistakes with polarity of high / low voltage mistakes.

For the other end of the connector I wired up a power cord so that a lamp can be plugged in and placed in a safe area. When I am done, the connector is unplugged and the car side of the connector is placed in a cutout area in the black styrofoam like material behind the battery so no-one can accidentally plug any A/C appliance in or touch any exposed metal prongs.

For the lightbulb, I used the type that can go into an oven so it can handle excess heat and they are usually low wattage. Mine was 40 watt. Also, once the DC voltage gets down towards 120v, you could also use a low watt normal A/C lightbulb (like 60w). I tend to like the 40w even though it will take a little longer to discharge. I keep a volt meter inline (prongs inserted into the power cord).

Make sure you do this with no kids around (or curous adults). Keep your car locked when discharging and high voltage wire harness connected. I did this in really cold New England weather so the IMA pack never really got warm at all (not even close). But if I had to do this in the summer, I would have the fan running.

Also, if you drive around with your IMA battery exposed (big metal cover off the car), keep the car locked so no curious person / child touch any of the high voltage areas. They should not be poking around but I would not want to have that on my mind if anything should happen to someone else that did not know NOT TO TOUCH.

BE SAFE!

JoeCVT

Could I get clarification of the setup relative to the master battery on/off switch and the "contactors" which I understand are only activated/on when the ignition switch is on and 12V power is supplied to the contactor(s).

I am assuming here one can simply have two wires hooked directly to the positive and negative terminal bolts on the battery (with diodes(s) first in circuit from battery side for protection everywhere downstream) and then a light bulb connected to these wires (use a female plug on battery side of this connection). Assume that external to the car fan control on/off is not needed for the discussion. Also, assume the battery is in the car all hooked up (versus a workbench/out of car discharge/charge process).

Given this setup, my questions are:

-do you need to have the master battery switch on?
-do you need to have the car's ignition switch on (contactor's activated) in order to discharge the battery?

Any problem you see doing it this way?

After re-reading the post:
"For the high voltage side, one goes the black cable (ground side) on top of the battery and the other goes down lower into the battery case (below the contact relay) so it is hot at all times. I have the inline fuse on the positive side."

Can someone post a picture of the connection point for the wire "below the contact relay". I assume that connection would allow discharge without having to have the ignition key on?

[Hugh-Falls]

A standard 240 volt twist-lock type receptacle with or without the spring loaded cap face plate could be used with JoeCVT's arrangement although it requires quite a large hole be drilled in the IMA box to surface mount it there. The cord to charger/discharger uses the matching plug. This arrangement is a bit pricey but meets most building codes for safety and should be adequate when applied to the Insight.

The disadvantage of this system is that the male plug from the charger will be energized by charger current and will be a shock hazard when charger is turned on so it is not fool proof.

[Mike Dabrowski 2000]

Here is what I use:
In car harness:
Male pins tyco 66589-1
Safety Cover tyco 211870-2
Bulkhead connector tyco 206705-1


Charger output cable:
Cable strain relief tyco 206966-7
Female pins tyco 66590-1
Straight connector tyco 206708-1

9 conductor wire Alpha 1896/9C
The way it is wired
http://99mpg.com/Projectcars/packdis...ctingthedisch/

Be safe

[eq1]

Here's some info about this question I brought up a while back. Feel free to ignore it and continue with the discharging set-up line of inquiry.

Originally Posted by eq1

Does anybody know, off the top of your head, what the imbalanced thresholds are? For example, perhaps the BCM or whatever needs to have all sticks, or all voltage taps at least, within 5%, 10%, 20% of each other in terms of voltage, voltage under load, maybe IR calculations, etc., before it will trigger a trouble code (1447 I think it is)?

This is one type of imbalance, that causes a 1449-74 code, called "Battery Module Individual Voltage Input Deviation," from the advanced troubleshooting pdfs accessed at one of the stickies atop one of these forums. Under certain conditions, if "the voltage difference between channels [voltage taps] is 1.2V or more for at least 25.4 seconds," the car will throw the 1449-74 error code...

Not sure if this is the way to explain it, but I think the primary 'enabling' conditions, that is, the conditions under which this diagnostic are valid, are these:

-The voltage tap voltage needs to be at least 14.5V
-The temperatures at the 4 thermistors need to be at least 77F
-Assist or discharge current needs to be between -20A and +11A

It looks like this is monitored continuously, that is, whenever these conditions are being met, the car is monitoring for the possibility to throw this code...

Here's the general description:

"The voltage difference between channels (12 cells/channel) is 0.61 V at the maximum within the allowable capacity range (15%). However, if one cell in a channel is abnormal, the voltage difference is 1.2V. Also, the voltage detection tolerance for the BCM (battery condition monitor) module is specified as ±0.12V at 32-140° F (0-60°C). Therefore, if the difference between channels is 1.2V or more, at least one cell is considered abnormal. If there is an offset problem or a gain problem in the voltage detection system, and the voltage detection error is out of the tolerance specified, a malfunction is detected and a DTC is stored."

Thought I'd include this here, too, for 1449-78. Do we know what the "upper and lower limits of the SOC voltage" are? Are these the 192V at the top and the 120V at the bottom, or perhaps voltage tap voltages?

[Eli]

I've personally never seen a P1449-74, but have read those sections of the manual before. Interesting to read them again.

I've never mentioned this before, but the BCM has balancing resistors inside of it. This is why the voltage taps always read within 0.01V of each other when you test them immediately after they were plugged into the BCM.