charging the 12V battery with no IMA

[Mike Dabrowski 2000]

I guess a small investment in an OBDII scanner would allow periodic checking to see if other codes appear?

[Mitch]

Originally Posted by Mike Dabrowski 2000

I guess a small investment in an OBDII scanner would allow periodic checking to see if other codes appear?

Good point, Mike. I'd certainly go out and buy the scanner and probably scedule a check-up to coincide with regular tire air pressure checks every month or so.

[b1shmu63]

Well Mitch, if and when the price of a used Insight gets anywhere near the cost of a new set of batteries, people like myself who would be able to repair/recondition the pack, or replace it with a salvaged one will be buying a used Insight as a second car. Furthermore, I believe we are going to see a surge of new and better batteries on the market soon. Once production catches up with demand, they will become available to electric car builders, plus Mike, myself and others who want to upgrade their Insight's performance.

Besides, lets assume that your battery dies just after the warranty and you have to buy a replacement. If your second battery lasts 100,000 miles, you have put 200,000 miles on the car for 2,500 dollars. Thats 80 miles per dollar of investment. Assuming your Insight gets 60 MPG and a similar car gets 30 MPG and that gasoline averages 3 dollars a gallon the "regular" car is paying an extra 4 dollars per 80 miles. That "regular" car will have cost its owner 10,000 dollars more to fuelup for that same 200,000 miles. In addition the Insight may cost less for repairs and maintenance over its service life due to the absence of an alternator, alternator belt, sparkplug cables, distributer, power steering pump, power steering belt, Plastic timing belt, and also because of its corrosion resistant aluminum body and stainless steel exhaust system.

Time will tell and experience will vary.

[Mike Dabrowski 2000]

Kip,
Nice summary.
The Insight will not die quickly, and seems to be getting more popular as a used car.
I have been getting 2-4 new inquiries a week about M**A. The backlog is up to 20 systems. Almost all of the orders are from people that just bought a used Insight, and want to modify the car into the most versitle hypermiler vehicle. It really seems that the $3 a gallon threshold magically flips a switch in peoples awareness.
The new owners are almost obsessed with wanting to use every tool available to max out their mileage.
When the backlog is filled their will be over 50 systems on the road.
Many also want FAS, so I will be working on a combination system with all the wiring to keep the DC/DC enabled when the car is in FAS.

[b1shmu63]

Although the battery should be able to handle the power requirements while in FAS, keeping the DC to DC going probably helps from a safety and redundancy perspective. For example it would keep the head lights at full intensity. This is something that a non hybrid can't duplicate. It may also get around the chicken/egg problem when trying to bump start an Insight with a dead 12 volt battery.

[Mike Dabrowski 2000]

Some new and interesting information about this subject.
A guy that bought the last MIMA system has an Insight he has been driving without the IMA pack. Here is what he had to say:

"You might find it interesting that the
remaining IMA components will keep the 12V battery charged with the HV
battery pack removed, so long as the BCM low voltage connector is also
disconnected and the MCM remains fully connected. The only catch is that
12V battery charging is temporarily suspended when engine RPM exceeds 4000.
I am presently replacing my battery pack, so I am using the Insight as a
pure-gas car right now (with pretty lousy acceleration).

My Insight was originally used by a battery company for battery development,
so it has not had the original Honda pack since 2000."
He is also building a replacement pack from Prius subpacks, which should also be interesting.

[meow77]

That's awesome.. then no need for the mods..

I'm stil trying to figure out if its worth running as a pure gas car? What is the mileage like I've heard the mileage suffer without the IMA not the other way around...

[Dougie]

I don't know about driving without a battery installed, but I drive my car in "gas only" mode most of the time and have a LMPG of 72.

[Mike Dabrowski 2000]

He has installed his hacked prius pack, and it is working. He will send me some photos and more information soon. He reported that before installing his replacement pack, the car was a bit sluggish but has been running fine.
No MPG info. I will try to get him to get on the forum so he can report on it directly.

[uhtrinity]

The possibility of using used Prius subpacks excites me as they are easier to find and are even cheaper than used Insight packs. Btw, what is the Ah rating of the Prius packs?

edit: Nevermind on the Ah rating, it looks like it is 6.5 Ah's