Alternate Insight drivetrains

[commuter]

Has anyone taken an Insight and removed and replaced the Hybrid drivetrain? If so, what kind of configurations are running around out there?

The reason I ask is my IMA battery is dead and at $4000 to $5000 to replace, I'm thinking about a change. This really got my mind racing. Maybe a Civic Si engine. Remove the 1.0 liter and battery and then you would have an ultra light weight street car. It would still get great gas mileage and would have great performance. But what about suspension, tires, steering all of that other stuff.

Plus how would the CA DMV ever know that the car didn't have the Hybrid system in place. I mean here in California we don't have to perform a smog check on our cars, so in theory you could get away with keeping the HOV stickers. Not that I would ever do that.

[boogetyboogety]

Interesting... a few random thoughts here...

Motor mounts would have to be custom-made... but you're right, drop in a little Honda four-banger in there and you'd probably have a cool little scooter.

I have to wonder what problems you'd face if you kept the original instrumentation... you might consider keeping the donor car binnacles and making it work in the Insight dash... yuck, that might be a mess...

Suspension, tires and steering... hmmmmm... you'd have to upgrade suspension for the added weight and weight distribution, and of course, your tire choice wouldn't matter as much as with a stocker Insight, as LRR tires wouldn't have to be part of the equation...

Having dealt with government entities over the years, and knowing how clueless they can get, it wouldn't surprise me if you're able to buy an Insight sticker and slap it on an H3 and get away with it. But seriously... doesn't your CA DMV require disclosure of substantial vehicle alterations? If not... would you report your drivetrain change to your insurance company? If you don't, and you're in an accident, they are perfectly within their rights to refuse the claim since somewhere in your policy, it says something to the effect that your vehicle should be, for the most part, unaltered (somewhat, within reason) from OEM. A drivetrain change would change the vehicle description to the insurer, and having a potentially-costly accident claim denied is a chance I wouldn't ever want to take...

And last but not least... do you really want to sacrifice a stock Insight? I mean, it will make the value of mine rise the fewer there are out there, but really... would you? Could you?

Wow, you're in Temecula.... loooove my Callaway wines... good luck and happy motoring, I'm curious as to the responses you'll get, if anyone's done this and what hurdles were overcome...

[Guillermo]

I've seen photos of Insights with Honda K20 engine and drivetrain from wrecked RSX type S cars and the front suspension from an RSX as well.
But this will cost much more then $4000

[Dougie]

What is the actual price you're being quoted for a battery replacement?

[LoNOx 1]

How many miles is on it. IMA warranty is for 10 years/150,000 miles.

[retepsnikrep]

Is it really dead? Or just thinks it's dead? Code?

Check Mike's MIMA site and here for lots of discussion on re-balancing old packs and possible replacements of weak subpacks with known good ones. IMA packs are available from salvage yards I notice from about $250-$1000 in US.

Probably worth testing and re-balancing your pack with a Triton 2 type charger, or a whole pack 250ma 175v psu, see if it fails again in short time, if it does then buy an old IMA pack and mix and match subpacks to get the best cells in your pack. Not rocket science, but time consuming, quite fiddly and def dangerous if you are not careful

[commuter]

I will answer some questions for everyone.

My 2000 Insight has 176,XXX miles on it. I've owned it for three years now. I Bought it with 75,XXX miles from a guy in Texas.

I'm currently working with Honda America to see if they will do some sort of "Good Will" extension to the IMA warranty. Keeping my fingers crossed. I have been speaking to CALHAC (subsidery of Honda America that deals with battery issues amoung other things) and they seem to think that Honda America may take care of this for free or least with a substantial discount.

I've been quoted any where from $4,200 to $6,500 for the replacement which would include the two control modules. Which doesn't make sense because my BCM was replaced at the product update about a year ago. I'm sure the dealer is just following what the recommended repair is for the codes that appear.

I don't know if the battery is really dead. All I know is that I've got the P1447 and P1449 codes. The codes have appeared 3 times now. Starting at 136,XXX, this was before the warranty extension from Honda. Next time at 167,XXX, this was after the warranty extension. And now 176,XXX. The codes were reset at 176,XXX and with 25 miles the codes appeared again.

I'm not real sure I want to break into the battery pack. I could probably do the work, but if I can get new parts from Honda for free, or deeply discounted I would rather go that route first.

Now back to the original intent of this thread. I was just thinking out loud if anyone has done anything to change the drivetrain of an Insight. So far some of the suggestions are very interesting.

Thanks to everyone for the input thus far. I knew I could count on my Insight Central knowledge base to get some good feed back. Keep it up and Happy Holidays.

[commuter]

Originally Posted by boogetyboogety

Wow, you're in Temecula.... loooove my Callaway wines... good luck and happy motoring, I'm curious as to the responses you'll get, if anyone's done this and what hurdles were overcome...

I live about 1/2 mile from Callaway winery. They have good wine, but there are better wines from Temecula. Let me know if you need any.

[IamIan]

Just making sure...

You do know that some people have driven an insight with no 144V battery at all in the car.... I haven't done it yet myself... but might try it just for the heck of it next spring / summer.

A few things and the DC-DC will keep the 12V charged up.... you will just not ever get the assist or regen without the 144V battery pack is all.... oh and if you ever get the ICE RPMs above 4,000 the DC-DC kicks off until you come back under 4,000 RPMs.... but 4,000 RPMs is a bit high... I almost never take my insight up that far.

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As for the drive train ... a few people have converted Insights to PURE EVs...

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But no other engine will be a drop in for the Insight....

Any alternate ICE will require custom parts, custom work , and will be more work and money than replacing the Battery from a junked Insight .... and if you want to pay someone else the hours it will take to do a ICE swap out... I would think you will spend more than buying a brand new 144V Insight battery.... Labor is expensive.

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Considering the number of awards and all the advanced technology in the Insight's 1.0L .... I doubt any other ICE would be able to come close to the performance....

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But best of luck.... I as with any modification to the Insight I will be happy to read all about it, when your done / as your doing it.

[b1shmu63]

It probably won't be long before someone here has figured out a way to use surpluce Prius modules for the Insight.

I can understand someone taking an Insight with a completely trashed powertrain and changing the engine, but we're talking a flakey battery here. Unless you have a machine shop or deep pockets, I'd go with a discounted pack, a rebuilt pack, or a salvaged pack.