Grid Charger Full Shopping List?

[Artric]

Update: Here's my stab at the full parts list, now that I've built one and ordered parts to help a couple of new friends.

This makes the assumption that you're using a gutted computer power supply (like the charger in my signature) and you have some cables left over from it to use. Otherwise, you'll need to buy a switch (optional), some screws (as would be used on a standard hard drive) and an outlet/power cable... as well as... well, something to put this in. Here's a combo switch/outlet.

It also assumes you have some basic tools that most should have at their disposal. You'll need solder, etc.

3x Mean Well RS-25-48
1x Mean Well RS-25-12 (spend the extra $3.50 over the RS-15-12 incase you want to power anything else)
1x Mean Well LPC-20-350
1x 18GA Inline Fuse Holder (for ceramic fuse to HV battery)
1x Panel Mount Fuse Holder (for the AC current side, mounted to case)
3x 10A Fast-Acting Glass Fuse (buy extras, they're cheap - for AC current side)
10x 1N4003 Diode (must order in multiples of 10 - for HV battery and fan connection)
2x Wire Tap/Splice (for tapping into fan wiring)
20x Splice Terminal (for various connections)
1x Grab Bag Solderless Terminals (I'll try to post the exact ones needed shortly - for HV power connection)
2x 1A Fast-Acting Ceramic Fuse (for positive HV battery connection)
10x Male Molex Connector (must order in multiples of 10 - for quick-connect of charger to battery)
10x Male Molex Pins (must order in quantities of ten - to populate molex connections)

You might also want to buy some heat shink tubing, if you don't have any. You should also have a multimeter handy, or you can buy one here cheap.


Original Post:
I'd like to build Mike Dabrowski's Grid Charger, but I'm worried that I'm going to miss things when I find and order them - especially since I'm not that familiar with electronics at this level.

Could someone help me make a COMPLETE shopping list at a reasonably priced online vendor?

Outside of the power supplies, I'd like to see every piece included, even wire. Let's assume I have nothing but tools. I can always skip any things that I have. I also want to make sure I have parts for a clean install to the battery.

I'll make a linked list for future reference if someone can help me find everything.

Thanks!

[RobertSmalls]

Here you go!

http://99mpg.com/Data/resources/down...d_charger1.pdf

I can help you tease a few specific part numbers out of that if you need it.

I recommend Jameco for a good combination of availability and price.

I plan to replace the +12V power supply with a +12V "always hot" rail, which can be found inside the IMA box. I also plan to run the DC/DC converter while grid charging.

[satchel]

That's the dual charger. Here is the basic grid charger: http://99mpg.com/Data/resources/down...balancer_2.pdf

I'm still hunting up parts myself. I really like JimIsbell's install in the battery compartment. Never have had anyone give wire sizes but all the other parts have been discussed in the grid charger thread. Peter give's good install info on his website.
I've had the meanwell power supplys sitting on the shelf for a while. I missed the firesale prices on ebay.

[Artric]

The thing is, I can't tell you how many times I've started reading the grid charger thread from the front, then from the back. I can't make it through that many pages.

I figure a full shopping list would be a great help for people like me. I'll try to get things started this weekend, then maybe I can get some help filling in the gaps.

What were the firesale prices on eBay?

[Artric]

Is there any reason why you couldn't use six 24v power supplies? This seems like a great source, and I could mount them in a computer case:

MeanWell Switching Power Supply +24V, 1A Qty 16 New - eBay (item 270574553925 end time Jun-04-10 06:53:07 PDT)

If so, that would be enough for almost three units. Please don't buy it from under me unless you want to sell me half!

[RobertSmalls]

I started wiring these 48V power supplies together, when I thought: this needs a "Danger: High Voltage" sticker, doesn't it?

Or does a properly constructed grid charger present little danger to humans due to the 1A max output?

I found 500 2"x3" vinyl labels for $17.60. Although it could be useful for all sorts of PHEV projects, I certainly don't need 500 labels.

[JimIsbell]

DISCLAIMER!!!!!
NONE OF WHAT FOLLOWS IS INTENDED TO ENCOURAGE ANYONE TO GET INVOLVED IN ANY ELECTRICAL PROJECT THAT HE/SHE DOES NOT FEEL PERSONNALY QUALIFIED, OR IS NOT QUALIFIED, TO GET INVOLVED WITH.

First, wire size.

For the AC wiring you should use #14 stranded but only because its easier to get. You surely don't need wire that big for the current. The currents here are VERY low. You could use much lighter wire but it would be very difficult to work with the smallest wire you COULD use.

For the DC wiring, #20 is way too big, but anything smaller is, again, hard to work with. The max current is only 350 ma, not 1 amp.

What is important is that you have insulation that can handle at least 600 volts. MOST, but not all, insulation will but check to make sure. You don't want it arcing between two wires.

.350 times 180Volts is just over 50 watts!!! That is very low power...VERRY low power, half of what a 100 watt light bulb uses. #14 wire can handle 15 amps!!! Thats 45 times the current we are talking about here!!!!

High voltage??? I guess its a matter of perspective....The voltage in your wall socket in the USA is 120 x 1.414 =170 Volts peak If you consider the wall socket on the bathroom wall to be HV, then this is HV. But you dont have danger HV stickers all over the house do you....or maybe you do. If you are in the UK where 220V is used the peak voltage is 220x1.414 = 311 volts....much higher than we are talking about here.

I am used to handling up to 25,000volts so this doesnt scare me, but it does demand my respect.

One rule, keep one hand in your pocket when working with any voltage over 24 volts. Its the path from one hand that touched a 170 volt terminal to the other, sweaty one, that you are leaning on the chassis with, that goes straight through your heart, that kills you. Also, as you might guess, DONT STAND IN A MUD PUDDLE while working on it...even with one hand in your pocket!!! Dry conditions, dry shoes, one hand in your pocket, The other hand using an insulated tool, respect, and knowledge of what you are touching will keep you OK.

BUT....its the amps that will get you and this battery has an, essentially, infinite capability....But, limited by the resistance that it is discharged over...your body.... If you are dry, and you get across it by just brushing a terminal with the back of your hand with the ability to pull away quickly....the biggest injury will probably be what you do to your hand when it hits something as you yank it back when your balls spark. I have cut myself severely just by yanking my hand past a sharp chassis edge at reflex action speed. Sometimes when I didn't actually touch anything, but just thought I had.....#

And the real warning:
Everyone has a different tolerance for electric shock. Old with a weak heart is not good. Young and in good health is better. Best is don't get shocked in the first place. I have survived with only a headache 25,000 volts but for another person, 30volts might kill. As the warning says, "Your voltage may differ!"

If you don't connect the AC plug to the power supply into the wall and don't connect the output to the battery, while you are building it, you cannot get shocked. The components themselves are safe to handle if you have never connected them to a power source. After it is built the AC plug will be just dangling in the trunk not connected to ANYTHING and all you have is two DC connections to connect to the battery. IF you have turned off the main breaker on the top of the battery module....AND everything is in stock, factory, condition, and you are not trying to work INSIDE the battery module...as I sometimes do, but YOU SHOULDN'T.......then you cant get hurt connecting the two DC wires. With that switch open, the battery is disabled. No current can flow so you are safe......again, if the wiring is factory stock up to that point and some idiot hasn't disabled the safety features that Honda designed into the system.

DISCLAIMER!!!!!
NONE OF THE ABOVE IS INTENDED TO ENCOURAGE ANYONE TO GET INVOLVED IN ANY ELECTRICAL PROJECT THAT HE/SHE DOES NOT FEEL PERSONNALY QUALIFIED, OR IS NOT QUALIFIED, TO GET INVOLVED WITH.

[RobertSmalls]

I hold anything < 50V DC to be pretty much harmless and okay to allow people to work around. Note how 12V runs through your computer and your car, and it's okay (from a safety perspective) to work on those without unhooking the power supply.

But anything higher than 50V DC is worth being careful with. Make sure users and passersby won't be exposed to it accidentally, and warn them about what they're dealing with. Paint it orange and label it High Voltage, or lock it up behind torx screws.

I think it's no accident that these MeanWell power supplies don't come larger than 48V.



Different rules apply for AC.

[randerson0248]

I think I read somewhere in the grid charger thread to use 18 ga. wire.

I searched a while ago to find that, but could not. 18 ga. is what I will be using anyway. No way that could be to small.

[ac7ss]

18 would be a minimum. You can easily get a cheap 14 or 16 ga extension cord with the proper number of prongs and cut off the female end. (About 2 bucks and has the plug molded on.)