Honda Insight Forum banner
Status
Not open for further replies.

OBDIIC&C Gauge

542K views 3K replies 165 participants last post by  retepsnikrep 
#1 · (Edited)
OBDIIC&C What will/does it do?

Well it plugs into the OBDII port like a scan/ultra gauge and

1) Reads and display ENGINE data, load, water & air temp, O2 sensor voltage etc
2) Indicates Lean Burn mode via green led
3) Reads and display IMA data bat temp, amps, voltage, soc etc etc
4) Reads, shows and clears IMA and ECM codes
5) Allows manual control of BATTERY fans and SOC level.
6) Has an audible water temp alarm

Is it better than the scan/ultraguage type devices?
Well that's for others to say, but it can access and display a lot of data they can't, including IMA specific information. It can also log/export data to a connected laptop directly into an excel spreadsheet.

The current version of the software and owners manual are below.

Firmware V11 01/02/2017 http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...ic-c_-_imac-c_18f2620_4hz_v11_9600_010217.hex

Owners Manual V11 http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...uge-peters-obdiic-c-pdf-master-010217_v11.pdf

Supports all cars and includes vacuum fluorescent display support and a few bug fixes.
We have the following OBDIIC&C threads currently running. Please choose the most relevant when posting.

This main thread is for all general queries, questions & comments.
http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...88-obdiic-c-gauge.html?highlight=obdIIC&C

The performance testing thread and spreadsheet. 30-60 & 50-70 mph times, discussion.
http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...rformance-testing.html?highlight=obdIIC&C

The ampere & watt hour counting thread.
http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...ng-obdiic-c-gauge.html?highlight=obdIIC&C

The RGB edition and other lcd mods thread.
http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...her-modifications.html?highlight=obdIIC&C

The gauge build notes thread for self assemblers.
http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...gauge-build-notes.html?highlight=obdIIC&C

The gauge troubleshooting thread.
http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...c-troubleshooting.html?highlight=obdIIC&C

The Civic HCH1 version thread.
http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...en-1-civic-hybrid.html?highlight=obdIIC&C

Related threads include.

The ECM/MCM/BCM revison thread and spreadsheet which applies to all Honda IMA cars.
http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...mcm-ecm-revisions.html?highlight=obdIIC&C

Please review any of these you are unfamiliar with and add data to the spreadsheets as relevant.
The more data we accumulate the better our understanding of the cars will become. :)

I have OBDIIC&C stock ready for dispatch. :)

I have built and tested units including 3d printed case. $350 inc postage and paypal fees.
I have a plentiful stock of plain pcb's. $49 inc postage and paypal fee.

All include lifetime software license. Hardware is rtb 3 year warranty.

All ready to go.

Thanks Peter
 
See less See more
#3 · (Edited)
I'll take three. ;)

How about that gizmo you posted about a while back? I studied it a bit. It seems to be a really nice piece of kit, as you would say.

Geoff's Projects - The Maximite

Perhaps a little expensive/overkill for these purposes though.

What does the C&C part stand for? Command and Conquer? :D

Data logging will be my main focus/want. Ideally, it would be nice to log every data point the car spits out!
 
#4 ·
One suggestion regarding DTCs:

Is there a way to get the blink code too? That's one of the great things about the HIM, it pulls the full code, ie: P1449-78, without having to try and read the dash blink codes. :)
 
#5 ·
One suggestion regarding DTCs:
Is there a way to get the blink code too? That's one of the great things about the HIM, it pulls the full code, ie: P1449-78, without having to try and read the dash blink codes. :)
Possibly like the BCM gauge it will evolve/improve over time as I make more discoveries about the data stream.

The Maximite looks a nice device but I'm getting quite familiar with the basic pics now and like a minimal hardware approach, no point in having another huge learning curve to get up to speed with that. Feel free to get one and program your own gizmo!

I like using the small pics as that forces me to refine the software to pack more into the code space, good mental exercise.

OBDIIC&C = On Board Diagnostic Command & Control
 
#6 ·
This may seem like a really stupid question but why not use dash command and an automotive PC. The "hybrid battery pack remaining charge" is a supported output along with the DTC's for an ODBII compliant ECU.

By removing the dash, laser scanning the surround and rapid prototyping a replacement, a TFT widescreen could be mounted in place of the LED dash and the sport button on the steering wheel used to scroll through a variety of screens.

You could then tooth the data to your android or iphone app and even get a real time graph of you MPG on screen...

or is this a really stupid idea?
 
#7 ·
There is so much more information available from the OBDII port that is Insight-specific, no aftermarket gauge is going to be able to compare to a purpose built job.

We might be able to make some XGauges for the Scangauge, but I don't think it will ever be able to grab all of the IMA data.
 
#9 ·
OBDII devices are a dime a dozen. Really, the whole point of this is to get IMA data. Anything else is just icing on the cake, as far as I'm concerned..
 
#10 · (Edited)
Mike you will be wasting your money if you want the IMA,SRS,ABS data and/or some of the Insight specific OBDII data. If you just want the generic OBDII data fine.

The Scangauge has the wrong connections and protocols to grab anything from the IMA side. It's a generic OBDII device with a few bells and whistles like the thing in your link, XGauge will not work for anything that is not sent/recd over the K/Line that sadly means detailed IMA,SRS,ABS stuff is not available to it.

I have now captured samples of data from every IMA,SRS,ABS command and am about 50% of the way through the Insight specific PGMFI ECU OBDII ones. There will now be a looonnnggggg pause as I study the data and work out what it all means and how to emulate it all. I have worked out the IMA CRC routine and now need to work on the software/hardware. Keep watching these threads for updates. For those with the BCM Gauge it may be possible for those who can weild a soldering iron to adapt it to do the basics.
 
#12 ·
Excellent Peter. Does that mean you got your new HIM working?

Does displaying a specific parameter in the HDS make it only request that data?
 
#15 ·
OBDIIC&C Gauge Pic 16F1825 Variant

Dear Members

Here is a proposed schematic for the production OBDIIC&C V1.00 pcb using a 14 pin Pic 16F1825
This has 4 times the memory and ram of the 12F683 I used in the BCM Gauge and runs at upto 32mhz on the internal oscilator instead of the 8mhz of the 12F683. So we have a lot more room for functions and data etc.

www.solarvan.co.uk/obdii/ODBIIGauge16F1825.jpg

I'll probably develop the basic software on the 12F683 as that forces me to be more careful about program size, then just port it over to the 16F1825 when I get some pcbs in stock.

If people are interested in a pcb put your name down on a list on this thread and post it here like on the MIMA thread. Just add your name to the growing list. I won't be supplying any other parts apart from the pcb or any ready built pcb's. There will be a parts list spreadsheet and you buy the bits and assemble it yourself. I don't have time to build the units. It will be a requirement to have the/a pic programmer as I will supply the hex files to download via the web. If someone wants to offer a build your pcb service for a fee then great. Please step up to the line.

I won't be ordering any pcb's unless I get at least 25 people on the list. :)

Cost of the Pcb $55. That might sound a lot but includes postage and a profit margin to cover the cost of funding my further research into the Insight. I'll need a US distributor for American buyers who can send out the pcb's if anyone wants to volunteer? PM me.

I estimate cost of the other parts inc the 16x2 serial lcd would be ~$45 so the whole thing can be bought/built for $100.

I am dividing the software up into four sections at present. When it starts you get a menu choice.

1) OBDII Mode. Can display 4 parameters on the screen at once from the general OBDII list. At present I have it displaying Water temp, Air intake temp, Engine Load, Lean Burn O2 Sensor. This is hardcoded at present, but you will be able to choose parameters later. This mode also allows display/clearing of ECU DTC codes.

2) IMA Mode. Will display 4 IMA parameters on screen as above from the IMA list. It will also display and clear IMA DTC codes. It will allow manual control of the battery & MDM fans and setting of the SOC level for those with grid chargers. Also allows setting of SCS mode for flashing dashboard light diagnostics.

3) ABS Mode. Will display 4 ABS parameters on screen as above from the ABS list.

4) SRS Mode. Ditto as above and will allow display/clearing of SRC DTC codes.

5) Config Mode to allow unit selection for display/logging etc etc.

Clearly there is a lot of work ahead, the hardware is the relatively easy bit, the software will be the challenge, but functions will be added on a regular basis as I decode the secrets of the data.

Comments?
 
#17 ·
I've read about the HDS software having a locked section. We have the general repair version, but under body electrical, there's a few more modules. The dash responds under body electrical. That allows you to calibrate the speedometer and set/reset odometer. There's also a section in there for the immobilizer data so we can program new keys to the car. I've only found small incomplete data on that stuff, so it may be the HIM that doesn't allow us to do those. I've read a little saying it's the HDS software that requires a certain dealer number to work correctly. They also said the immobilizer section requires a connection with the Honda mother ship.
 
#18 · (Edited)
I'm sure we will eventually sort most of this stuff :) I have been looking at it.

Sorry Right Lane Cruiser there is no built pcb option from me.

All the other stuff you mention should be possible as we progress over the next year or so. Please be patient though.

Latest video

 
#19 · (Edited)
Pcb List

Please add your names to this list if you want a bare pcb. Cost $55 inc P&P

Right Lane Cruiser x 1 (Prebuilt)
MadManMostafa x 1 (Prebuilt)
 
#21 ·
Just to make sure my position is understood in relation to this thread, I am not defeating the proprietory security systems or software controls. The work I am doing is purely to interogate the IMA and other onboard systems to gather live technical data/dtcs for my IMA/Gauge control projects. Access to this data is enshrined in EU Law and not allowed to be the sole right of the dealers. i.e. You can get you car repaired where you want in the EU and they must all be able to reset codes or do diagnostics etc
 
#22 ·
Please add your names to this list if you want a bare pcb. Cost $55 inc P&P

Right Lane Cruiser x 1 (Prebuilt)
MadManMostafa x 1 (Prebuilt)
Eli x 5

I would be up for assembling the PCBs for people once I figure out how long it takes and the cost of parts.
 
#23 · (Edited)
I also agree that it would be nice to mix and match the displayed parameters. It would also be nice to get more than four. A lot more. :)

Will the device only be able to log the displayed parameters? I would like to be able to monitor and log say 10 parameters at once, and am willing to be patient for such features as this project evolves. Being able to log 10+ parameters while only 4 are displayed might be acceptable though?

It's very early in it's development - I almost wonder if we should allow a prototype design to be designed, built and used for a while before you settle on a mass production design?

I think a 20x4 LCD at minimum would be much more suitable for this device. $100 for a device this powerful is an absolute steal when something like the Scangauge is $160-180.... I'm not concerned about spending a little more on components.
 
#24 · (Edited)
Goods points Eli the lcd can be swapped at will already for a 20x4 device, but I'm also concious of those who have a 16x2 serial lcd from the BCM gauge.

Breadboard & software development is taking place using the 12F683 and a 16x2 lcd.
I have a 20x4 to hand ready for when I get to that stage. Expanding the stuff on screen for easier readability is simple when we move to the bigger pic, at the moment it's the processing the data which I'm concentrating on.

I'm going to start sending commands to the MCM today to see what happens.
I think i have the IMA BATTERY and MPI fan controls worked out :)

Logging of the parameters on display is very easy and logging more will come later, but anything we get over the bus can be squirted out of the serial to usb lead as now.

I assume Eli you would be up for being a prototype tester? With early access to the code :)

Edit

Here are two revised schematics.

1) Is the 12F683 version I'm using on the breadboard for code/hardware development. Eli if you want to build this you can assist. :)
www.solarvan.co.uk/obdii/OBDIIGauge.jpg

2) Is the 16F1825 version for the proposed commercial release version.
www.solarvan.co.uk/obdii/ODBIIGauge16F1825.jpg

Video showing a bit more progress. IMA Fan Control. :)

 
#25 ·
Absolutely. :)

It would kinda be nice to have even more than ten parameters to be honest. I think of this as an "All in one" device. Like an "Insight Gauge". If you pick four ECM parameters that the Scangauge can display plus the five BCM parameters that the BCM Gauge displays that's already 9, and off the top of my head it would be nice to see Knock Retard, Air/Fuel Ratio, ELM(total car amp draw), and probably others... :) I know this is probably all easier said than done...

Have you ever thought about using something like this? Please forgive me if this is ridiculous as I have no idea what is involved with implementing such a thing compared to the simple character LCDs, but you could do some pretty amazing things with it I bet.

132x132 pix Serial Color Graphic LCD SPI PIC ARM AVR | eBay
 
#26 · (Edited)
Have you ever thought about using something like this? Please forgive me if this is ridiculous as I have no idea what is involved with implementing such a thing compared to the simple character LCDs, but you could do some pretty amazing things with it I bet.

132x132 pix Serial Color Graphic LCD SPI PIC ARM AVR | eBay
I have looked at those but have not the time or inclination to do anything with one. Someone else can have a go.

I don't think the elm value is available from the ECM, as the sofware evolves things will get added, don't expect too much too soon.

As you add more parameters to your monitored list the refresh rate will fall accordingly.
eg with ten parameters we might be able to refresh at 1hz, with 20 at 2hz, and with 5 at 0.5hz etc etc.
 
#29 · (Edited)
The ELM is in the PGM-FI screen. :) I guess it's called ELD.

The car/HDS can log up to 10 different parameters in "high speed" mode. I think that's where my basic ten number came from.

32MHz is a very fast processor. It shouldn't have any trouble keeping up with what the car can spit out. I think even the 8MHz pic should be able to, but then again I'm not a programmer. I'm having trouble understanding why for example in the case of the BCM Gauge the 8MHz pic takes 1.6 million clock cycles for each update if it's at 5Hz? Is that normal?
 
#31 · (Edited)
32MHz is a very fast processor. It shouldn't have any trouble keeping up with what the car can spit out. I think even the 8MHz pic should be able to, but then again I'm not a programmer. I'm having trouble understanding why for example in the case of the BCM Gauge the 8MHz pic takes 1.6 million clock cycles for each update if it's at 5Hz? Is that normal?
Remember I'm no programmer either or i would be doing this in assembly and using more interrupt driven processess. The 12F683 does not have a hardware USART to recieve the data so sits around quite a lot of the time wating for info to appear on the BATTSCI bus. We have no control over BATTSCI so have to wait about quite a lot for that as well. Processing the data, caluclating Ah & driving the lcd at 9600 baud take quite a lot of time. The pic level instructions per second on an 8mhz pic is actually 2 million. Each pbpro level instruction takes quite a few pic level instructions.

I think we will be able to handle and log a mixed selection of 10 parameters a second on the OBDIIC&C gauge that's my target. Anything else will be icing on the cake.

Remember the PLX-DAQ software that gets the data into excel can only handle ~27 data fields in one go, we used at least 10 or more of those already for the BCMGAUGE DATA.

All this is at least six months away though. I have now ordered a couple of the 16F1825 chips I will breadboard one when it arrives. If there are no hardware issues i will get the pcb produced fairly quickly.

Talking about the pcb it has the switch built onto it so we need to think about the layout of it and how it would be mounted in the car. Any ideas. Bear in mind I'm thinking of using a sparkfun 20x4 serial lcd as the standard display. :? The switch could be mounted on the reverse of the pcb and could be connected with short wires from the pcb if necessary to give a bit more flexibility. Thoughts?


OK How about this for an enhanced serial display for this long term project. Includes buttons and status leds :)



http://www.matrixorbital.com/Intell...219/LK204-7T-1U-YG/product_info.html?CDpath=1

http://www.matrixorbital.com/p1144/B19264-BK-(Black)/product_info.html

Yes it's more expensive than the sparkfun but a lot faster with more features! Might fit into a din slot?

Probably knocks $5.00 off the pcb and parts list price for the OBDIIC&C itself as well.
Anyway I have bought one to play with. :)
 
#32 ·
Theres are some seriously impressive displays on that site! Nice Bezel aswell.

I think this gauge feature content demands more display area but then where do you draw the line with the cost and information at hand.



I think thats for a desktop PC so far too detailed for your eyes to read it whilst driving.

Nice Simpson reference: :D




Personally I think the switch remote mounted will offer far more flexibility. These screens look like the narrower PCB also will help with the space needed and fit probably fit just infront of the cupholders.

Sterling work Peter on getting the real work on this done though. :cool:
 
#34 ·
Personally I think the switch remote mounted will offer far more flexibility. These screens look like the narrower PCB also will help with the space needed and fit probably fit just infront of the cupholders.
The switch on this lcd works in a completely different way to the one i use at present and will likely be much more reliable/flexible and it also commuicates back to the pcb via serial comms at the speed we choose. Anyway food for thought :?
 
#35 · (Edited)
Great project Guys.
May I suggest that you consider an 18F series Pic for this project.
In quantity, you are only talking $3-4, and they can run at 40 MHZ and 10 MIPS, They have hardware USART, and multiple A/D, PWM, and and have a lot of on board memory both for the program and flash.
Why limit your self with the low pin count processors which are really not that much cheaper in the big picture?
Keep up the great work.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
You have insufficient privileges to reply here.
Top