Here is an example of battery improvement through refurbishment cycling. This "transcript" is of two refurbishment efforts of 3 cycles each, separated by a week, with parameter changes in the middle. You will note in the middle of the exchange that I recommended some parameter changes. I'm not sure there is anything more to be gained since the cell drops are now occuring in the low 130's. We might be able to make the discharge times a bit longer by extending MaxChgTime* a bit, but the car won't treat the battery that way anyway.
Jim, Values with your latest settings below.
Bank 0 Cycle 1
DCT 222 SDV 176.8
DisR 2, EDV 130.6
PAH 76, SCV 130.6
ChSR 3, ECV 170.2
mAH 4935 WtH 802
ChT 540, TpT 394
Bank 0 Cycle 2
DCT 175 SDV 170.2
DisR 2, EDV 131.3
PAH 75, SCV 131.3
ChSR 3, ECV 170.4
mAH 4900 WtH 798
ChT 540, TpT 397
Bank 0 Cycle 3
DCT 168 SDV 170.4
DisR 2, EDV 133.0
PAH 74, SCV 133.0
ChSR 3, ECV 170.7
mAH 4828 WtH 788
ChT 540, TpT 403
Subject: Re:charge result help
OK, here are the parameter variations that I used when I was doing refurb work on my spare pack.
Cut-backVP*1 168. (This makes the charger charge at the higher voltage for a couple of more volts, cutting down on the refurbishment time. I think it is ok in cold weather is the fan control is installed, as in your setup)
TopTime MN* 1100 (This keeps the charger working at the 350mA for a longer period, giving more soak)
SampleTime* 60 (This makes the charger run a bit longer before tripping off.)
Slope Dif Max * 80(This makes the discharger discharge deeper, perhaps improving the condition of weaker cells. There are other protections anyway.)
Sent: Nov 7, 2012 3:12 PM
Subject: Re: charge result help
If you have the time to figure out what would be best to try so I can just plug in values that would be great.
Here we go again.
A charger owner that lives in Iceland, asked me to modify the V2.4 code so it worked better in charging a cold car.
Up until this request, the advise for cold charging was to warm the car and battery by driving, then set up a heater to maintain the temp during the charging process.
This did not work for them, as the car only has a short commute in the cold climate, so it would be a big waste of time and gas to drive it a few miles just to warm it up.
All good points.
They also wanted to be able to charge each night by simply applying AC power with an extension cord to the heater and charger, so the charger would automatically start the charge process, and they would not need to go out in the cold to start the process.
I got to work yesterday and have a new version of the code V2.5
The delayed charge modes 3-4 have a programmable delay.
On the earlier code, the fan does not run during the delay, so they found that even if the car was warm, the battery did not begin to warm until the charge was started, and the pack fan turned on. After the 2 minute fan stabilization, the charger would see the cold air from the pack, and would shut down, requiring several trys before the pack started to rise above the 40F minimum the outlet temp limit allowed. Setting the cold charge option on lowers this temperature limit to 30F. This limit can be easilt lowered in the Tech edit mode, so if anyone wants to make adjustments to the limits, just give me a call, and I can guide you through the process.
V 2.5 now runs the fan as soon as the start key is pressed (or Autostart) in the two delayed charge modes.
That way you can turn on the delayed charge and the heater, and the car and battery will warm so that when the charge actually starts, all will be in the proper charge temperature zone.
Also have incorporated a new option that allows the charger to start the delayed charge modes automatically when the charger is powered up.
To enable this Autostart, I changed functionality of the last option bit (Precharge on off when in mode 6), so it works as it does now when the charger has mode 6 selected, but acts as an autostart on /off when the charger is in mode 3 or 4 . The message shown in the option setup reflects this change, and the bit becomes non volatile like the temp and bank bits are now.
Once mode 3-4 and the Autostart option is set, the charge will start automatically, run to plateau or to the end of a soak charge on each power on until the bit is turned off, or the mode is changed.
I spent over $400 on postage upgrading all the chargers with V 2.4, and still have not received over half of the microcontrollers that were sent out,(thanks to all that have sent them back) so this upgrade, which I don't consider a bug fix but an enhanced operating mode will cost people $25, to help defray the cost of buying a bunch more microcontrollers and the postage.
Contact me via e-mail if you have the need for this new code.
All chargers produced from now on will have this new feature, as well as all upgrade kits from the original V1.2 code.
Ah, come on guys. Send the microprocessors back to Mike. They really aren't yours to keep, since he gave you a free upgrade. Mike is not a rich man and can't really afford to lose lots of money. On top of that he has been very generous with help and advice that no one else would have ever dispensed at this level
I am not able to use the Labview datalogger on the only other computer I have running XP.
It may be the notebook, so instead of you all waiting for me to try and figure out the issues when running this well behaved program (when running on my desktop) on other machines that I dont have available, here is a zipped version of the two programs, the config and the datalogger. Unzip the files, run the two setup programs, with the only caveat that both exe files want to be in the same directory.
The config should run first, and its main job is to generate a config file that identifies the comm port, the , the path to the home directory for the programs and config file, and datalog file directory.
***************UPDATED to current files 12/9/2012******************** http://99mpg.com/Data/resources/down...configv2.5.zip http://99mpg.com/Data/resources/down...loggerv2.5.zip
Let use this thread to see what issues you guys have.
I have run it on a vista notebook, but it crashed the box after 30 minutes of datalogging, so it may be best to start with the XP machines that you guys may have.
The setup installs a National Instruments folder in the program files, where it places the run time LabviewV7
The programs will un install like any exe file.
Hope to hear some good news.
An example of the GC_config.txt file
ASRL5::INSTR C:\Documents and Settings\HP_Administrator\Desktop\Charger Data logger DEV\GC_config.txt M:\New datalog files
first is the port ---next is the path to the exe and config file ------------------------------------------------------final is the path to the directory that the datalog files will go to.
on the topic of cold weather charging.... has anyone ever had to change the TDifMaxRaw variable? Only reason I am thinking about that is because with colder temps near 40F, charger won't give me a good soak charge but shuts off with R9 after about an hour of topping. Now I have a thermostatically controlled heater setup in the car but having set it to about 50 degrees I am still having the same problem. Part of it may be not setting enough of a delay between driving home and starting charge, in which case the battery is still hot when charge starts and the incoming air right below the rear window is still kinda cold. I am still playing around with it, I think the "fan on during delay" fix might be relevant to this issue but just curious about upping the TDifMaxRaw variable from the current setting of about 8 degrees F.
The 8 degrees was selected based on running a test charge with the cutback V set to 180, so the 1A remained through out the charge. when the pack topped off at 1A, the temperature difference got to ~10F, so I selected 8 as a limit.The 350ma topping will usually only show 4-6 degrees difference when the charge is just finished
In the temperature extremes, one can see bigger differences, which is why this fan running during the delay makes a lot of sense.
I ran a test charge on my car today.
the ambient was ~35F, the car and pack were at ~ 30-31F.
The 1200W heater was set for ~55-65F
The car got up to ~55 in about 15 minutes, and the heater cycled to keep it there al afternoon. I wish I had put my kilawatt meter on the thing to see how much juice the heater used.
The pack took about 40 minutes to get up to ~47, which is where the charge started. I had a 60 minute delay.
I had set the new Autostart option, Left the charger power switch on, and had the heater switch also on, both plugged into a plug strip and 12GA extension cord.
I started the process by plugging in the extension cord, and both the charger and the heater ran as expected. the delay counted down, while I watched both the inlet and outlet temperatures.
Mike, Looks like it will run on Win 8. Or at least it opens. I've put up screen shots of the way it opens. Will hook it up later to charger.
#1 - 2000 Silver #4965, not working now, 175k Miles, 61 LMPG - will probably turn into all Electric
#2 - 2000 Silver #4095, 212k Miles, 55 LMPG, OBDIIC&C by Peter, GCIM1 by Mike, New MaxIMA by Eli www.TucsonEV.com
I have been getting file open errors as have a couple of other people when I try to open it on an old IBM thinkpad with XP.
The problem here is that I don't have a lot of computers to try it on that do not also have the full Labview installed, which seems to replace the runtime when the program is run.
It is pretty easy to recompile after I make any changes, so the more people we have testing the results the better, and it looks like we should not rule out the newer operating systems.
I can try to generate new versions with tweaks to solve the problems, as they are identified.
I can also send anyone that is Labview proficient the source programs, so they can work with me to get this working.
I think I will do a video today of how to use the programs , and how it works when it is working correctly, as there is so many features that it would take a 20 page manual to explain it all.
Have been thinking about an analysis tab, where the results from a full reconditioning 3 cycle set are analyzed to quantify the pack condition.
Programing a microcontroller where I have full control of all the hardware, is so much easier than trying to write an exe file for a PC, where there are so many things going on in the background that I have no clue about.
Monitor size, serial port setup, printer ,memory limits , operating systems, - - - - -(all the other stuff)
If you have tried the Labview programs, and get a File open error 7, It probably is because the program is trying to write 32 bit files on a 64 bit File system or vice versa?
Right click on the un opened file, and In the exe properties, there is a selection for running the programs in the XP compatibility mode.
I need to know what you guys are seeing, working or not so we can figure out how to set it up to work.
I can't test it on multiple machines, only you guys can do that, and if we keep at it, we could have a bunch of people using the program in short order.
I tried a number of alternative methods that still leave the Error 7 file not found:
Installed as Administrator
Run as Administrator
Installed into a simplified directory (no spaces) at c:\gc
Created GC_config.txt file in various places in case it needed to be predefined
Changed compatibility mode...though I could only change to Win98 on my XP system
If this was created on a 64 bit XP system maybe it can't run correctly on a 32 bit XP system? I don't see a compatibility mode for that (64 on 32 bit).
I have WinXP Pro 2002 SP3 32 bit
Last edited by bluesight; 11-30-2012 at 11:42 AM.
The AutoGuide.com network consists of the largest network of enthusiast-owned enthusiast-operated automotive communities.
AutoGuide.com provides the latest car reviews, auto show coverage, new car prices, and automotive news. The AutoGuide network operates more than 100 automotive forums where our users consult peers for shopping information and advice, and share opinions as a community.