I don't know much about solar, electricity, HVAC, etc. Much discussion has been made here of solar powered fans cooling the car during the summer. This gave me the idea to ask a corollary question ...
Could a solar powered system be used to HEAT the car during the winter?
Obviously, the amount of heat generated would not be all that significant, but even keeping the car a bit warmer in extreme cold sounds desirable to me. (Both while driving and parked)
Thought the amount of heat generated would be very small, every little bit would help. If it could impact the interior temp of the car by 1 degree, would it be helpful while driving by not having to extract as much heat from the engine (which I have read is quite a problem in very cold weather, auto-stop, etc.). It might be like setting the climate control system thermostat to 60 while only extracting heat from the engine as if it were set to 59?
Likewise, a bit of warmth added to a parked car for long periods of time would be nice. Perhaps this would be the best benefit of solar powered heaters.
I plan to do the solar colling fan system using Uni-Solar FLX-11 (I think), and was wondering if this investment could have a dual purpose of a bit of extra heat in winter cold.
Putting a mat black mat in the hatch area would work. Insulating the car body would help. Blocking the rad and using a hot air intake help. A dark paint job helps too. Some cars including the new Prius store warmth from the engine in a thermos bottle. The good thing about heat in the winter is that all of it is derived as a waste by product of engine operation.
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Kip Munro
The laws of physics don't need changing, but rather our attitude and values. 72.8 LMPG
Right, passive solar heating is the most bang for the buck in this case. b1shmu63's suggestions are very good. I don't believe anything more complex would be reasonable for this application, but hey, how much money do you want to spend?
I have reflective tinting on my windows, which reject heat pretty well. I wonder if there is the reverse available for solar? Probably. Sure would be hot now, though...
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2000 #893
LMPG 73.3, same speed too
Solar power would work by converting the incident solar energy (mostly visible) into heat. Unfortunately, solar power is quite inefficient, on the order of 10%-20% just to gather the incident light and convert it to electricity. Also, cold days have a much lower incidient solar radiation at the earth surface, which is a big part of why they are cold days, and not hot days. And if it's cloudy, you can forget about it.
If the solar panel is there, any benefit to use it?
Thanks for all the great info.
I guess my question remains this ... since I am going to have the solar panels in the car anyway (from the summer cooling fans), could I expect any beneficial result from disconnecting the cord from the fans, and attaching it to a (obviously) very small heating element (trivial cost)?
I just imagine that the contribution from photovoltaic resistance heating would be miniscule in the big picture....
Thanks Holicow ... That answer really provided what I was looking for ... "miniscule". Perhaps once the solar panel is in place, I will connect it to an auto cigarette lighter, and see (probalbly not see, but rather feel!) what hapens!
___If you drive during midday in late fall/winter/early spring, you can go coatless all the way down to the about the low 40’s just with the heat load generated from the rear hatch’s window. This is on a bright and sunny day. Below that, it’s a light jacket down into the low 30s, heavier jacket and light gloves in the 20’s … in the teen’s, on goes a hat and below that, you will have the life (mpg’s) sucked out of her as you turn on the heat. At least it’s can be warm and cozy while cruising down the freeway.
___As for the cigarette lighter resistance heater, forget about that one. The draw from the 12 V - off the pack - off the MGSet will be far more then just pulling the heat from the ICE’s coolant as its mostly waste heat anyway … unless that is you are really pushing the fuel economy envelope, then its lifeblood
___Good Luck
___Wayne R. Gerdes
___Hunt Club Farms Landscaping Ltd.
___[email:39kg3mtb]Waynegerdes@earthlink.net[/email:39kg3mtb]
We have one of those "coolers" (to me, a cooler is a plastic box with a lid, where I put ice and sodas for adult beverages and perishable food; these newfangled things I'm referring to are some sort of punky refrigerator) that plug in to the cigarette lighter in our travel vehicle (the "Big Ass Van"). They work on some sort of thermoelectric voodoo that converts 12v into cooler temperatures without the bother of coils, freon, or whatever chemicalia exists in our real 'fridge. It does have a pitiful little fan which makes more noise than moves air IMHO. But it does work.
Now... You can also reverse the polarity of the cable, which then provides... heat! Enough to heat the contents of the "cooler" (now a "heater") to the borderline-lethal-to-bacteria level of 145 degrees. :twisted:
This miracle happens with 12v, and manages to heat approximately (guessing here, eyeballing it) 1.5 to 2.0 cu. feet of "cooler" (I mean, "heater") -enclosed mass to 145 degrees within a pretty short interval of time. Surely the coolers are not that pricey, especially if a lucky garage used-"cooler" sale buy is possible now that summertime is on the wane. May I humbly suggest the sacrificing of one of these gadgets, to see if the innards may be used for whatever minuscule amount of heat may be created thereby?
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Driving on down the road in my 2001 CVT, going "Boogety Boogety" ...and until avatars are provided, my car looks just like the original silver Insight on the header, above... =)
Those coolers you are reffering to use peltier devices to heat or cool. Basically you pass DC electricity through it one way it pulls heat to one side, reverse it and it pulls it to the other side. It can only get so cold or so hot, something like 40 degrees of ambient either way. I've tried one in a vehicle here and the result durring the summer was only marginally cool water bottles after a few hours.
I was browsing around a few weeks ago looking at some EV conversions and saw one where the owner had made a large peltier array for cooling and heating which he said worked quite well. There were no pictures or anything beyond the description unfortunately. This idea has been on my mind as of late, the question is would a peltier array fed by the IMA motor be more efficient than the AC compressor turned by a belt from the engine? You could at least have auto stop with cool air. BTW, you can buy peltiers in bulk fairly cheaply.
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Later, Ricky
02 Red Insight - Sold
06 Silver Civic Hybrid
92 Saturn SC2 Electric, Arizona Alt fuel plate "ZEROGAS"
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Solar powered HEAT?
