Check Engine Light

[RavenHybrid]

Hi, I'm a newbie to the site and I was hoping to get some technical help or advice regarding my Check Engine light.

Ive had my 2001 Insight for two years and it has about 140,000 miles on it. Ever since I purchased it (I'm the 3rd owner) Ive found I have a happy Check Engine light! It just loves to come on! I use to think the worse, now Ive come to realize its just the fuel cap. I tighten it and the light goes off in a few days.

But lately I think its getting worse and I'm thinking it might be more serious. When I get gas I can smell it in my car after I leave the station. And the light comes on more frequently.

Today I got a diagnostic from Auto Zone (the only place with free diagnostic!) and the troubleshooting code was P1456 "emission control system leak detected"

It said there's 4 different problem causes:

1. Loose fuel cap
2. Vapor canister saturated
3. Failed vent solenoid
4. Failed purge solenoid

I have no idea what the last three mean.

Do other Insights have this problem?
Any suggestions or mechanical advice?

I haven't got a full diagnostic from Honda because they want to charge me $90 which I don't have. So I'm hoping its just the fuel cap.

[mikemo]

I'm not sure exactly what your problem is, but I can tell you that the fuel system is designed to be totally sealed so that no vapors can escape. If you smell gas, that tells me that vapors are escaping. The car also knows that the system is no longer sealed, hence the check engine light. Perhaps there is a crack in the gasket on the gas cap? Maybe the fuel filler hose is cracked, or maybe the gas tank itself (it is plastic).

A factory service manual from helminc.com would help you a lot.

Sorry I couldn't be more help.

[rajuncajun]

1. Loose fuel cap
2. Vapor canister saturated
3. Failed vent solenoid
4. Failed purge solenoid

#2 = Carbon-filled canister that absorbs gas fumes from the tank is saturated with fumes, presumably this means it needs replaced.

#3 and 4 are both electric valves and I believe one is between the gas tank and the carbon canister and the other between the canister and the engine. They work together to control when gasoline fumes are sent to the canister for storage, and when they are sent to the engine to be burned off.

These errors and parts are all associated with the evaporative emission system (EVAP). The EVAP system's job is to capture fumes from the gas tank either when you get gas or when pressure in the gas tank builds up from increasing temperatures. The fumes are stored temporarily in the vapor canister before being sent to the engine to be burned off later when the engine is hot and running.

I would definitely get the Helms book since it will show you where all of these parts are. If you have a cracked hose or bad solenoid valve it could cause the fumes to escape instead of being stored in the canister and burned later. This may be why you're smelling the gas odor.

My wife's old civic had the EVAP canister removed by the previous owner (why I have no idea, it was kind of riced-out when we got it). The vapor tube was plugged with a rubber stopper, so you could only put gas in the tank VERY slowly or else it would shut off the nozzle b/c gas would accumulate in the filler neck b/c the vapor in the tank had no place to escape when it was displaced by fuel. We poked a pin-hole in the cap and that fixed the problem with slow refueling, but on hot days you could definitely smell gasoline. Also, the car showed a check engine light with the same codes you're having but ran fine.

Good luck, this might be an easy fix.

[BillR]

I hope that I have an easy solution for you.

When you fill the car with gas, do you keep adding fuel until you can't get any more in? The fuel systems on modern cars are not meant to be filled right to the top, but gas jockeys and self fillers love to round the price up to the next dollar. Over filling can result in raw gas getting into that canister when it should only be handling vapors. This can happen right when you fill the tank or later when the gas heats up and expands.

The next few times that you fill up, stop after the first time the pump nozzle shuts off. This should leave enough air in the tank and filler tube to prevent gas going into the vapor canister. If the codes go away - you're grinning!

Hope this helps,
Bill

[Hitech]

My 02 If you can smell gas inside the car and you have that code then you have a leak. Likely in the filler pipe to tank area or the tank cover/pump/sender unit or hoses to the various bits. That code is a "two cycle" code meaning that it takes two "faulted" drive cycles before it puts the MIL light on

[mikeross]

You might be having a bad leak.. There is a possibility that it is a factory defect or the valve cover.. I hope not but the best thing to do is to have it checked because if you smell gas and it is leaking, then it might start a fire or something like that.

[archebald23]

Originally Posted by mikeross

You might be having a bad leak.. There is a possibility that it is a factory defect or the valve cover.. I hope not but the best thing to do is to have it checked because if you smell gas and it is leaking, then it might start a fire or something like that.

i agree, its the most probable cause. check your lids and covers. and i suggest you have your codes read for a more specific diagnostics. it might be a bigger problem than you think.

[gotslicks]

just out of curiosity, do you want to fix the problem for inspection purposes or just because you hate seeing the light?
its a really common problem with all obd2 cars.
there is no easy way to fix it most of the time.
but.....the dealer or any cornwell tools equipped mechanic can pump smoke/fog into the system to find the leak.
it does get pricey due to diagnostics

[archebald23]

Any updates on this? when i get an engine light i resort to sites with how to's like how to troubleshoot a check engine light or something to get an idea on the possible causes and solutions then i narrow it down.

[Ullearn]

Just bumping the thread to see if RavenHybrid ever found a solution?

My problem is similar 02 Honda Insight 106k miles manual transmission, a year ago I started getting P1420 code - Manufacturer Control Aux Emission Controls

Sometimes I would reset it and it wouldn't come back for a couple months, other times it reset itself. I started thinking it was Shell Gasoline causing the problem since they are known for having too much water mixture in their gas (or so the small engine repair shop near my home says as it tears up lawnmowers left and right). But even after switching off the gas I now get the same issue with Exxon and others, etc...

So the check engine light is back on and now in the cabin of my car it smells like gas. Is the gas smell any bit related to the P1420? It doesn't smell right after fill-up, but usually at half a tank of gas; can the cats cause this?

Since I saw the other thread I think I will see if the dealer will goodwill coverage my P1420 code.

Quality Update: Insight MT's & DTC's P0420,P1420,P2000