Need quick help on deciding to proceed with update/recall done!

[OttawaGeorge]

Hi guys, I’m short on time today to search and consolidate the info from posts...hope someone who knows these issues well can help me out before Honda does something I wouldn’t want them to…

I dropped my 2000 off for a free Honda inspection this morning and they notified me the car has three recalls outstanding. The campaign numbers are J70 IV-07-01, K43 IV-7-06, K66 V-5-07. I popped my VIN into the Honda recall webpage and they showed 2 product updates: Insight control units and software update.

I remember reading one of these changes the charging profile and kills the FE, can someone quickly provide the pros and cons to these recalls/updates?

Thank you!
George

[OttawaGeorge]

The 3 product updates turned into 2 then 1.

The IMA Replacement (November 2001 issuance) was cancelled due to the IMA controller being discontinued (their words). This update concerns the IMA battery providing excessive output when below -10C. For the record my car didn't seem to have this issue as I've noticed the car is slower in these conditions which is backstopped by ~ 1/2 assist showing until the car warms up.

However they are doing the software update dated October 2007 which requires tossing the old hard coded ECU and replacing with a free replacement ECU. I guess if I install the clutch switch mod, it's not a terrible thing to have a more agressive charge program as I can pause it whenever I wish.

[Willie Williford]

correct.
Willie

[Hybrid-Battery-Repair]

Excessive charging, not excessive discharging.

It more has to do with how the car tries to charge the battery when it is frozen solid (before it thaws).

Originally Posted by OttawaGeorge

The 3 product updates turned into 2 then 1.

The IMA Replacement (November 2001 issuance) was cancelled due to the IMA controller being discontinued (their words). This update concerns the IMA battery providing excessive output when below -10C. For the record my car didn't seem to have this issue as I've noticed the car is slower in these conditions which is backstopped by ~ 1/2 assist showing until the car warms up.

[Hybrid-Battery-Repair]

If you aren't having a problem don't let them "fix" it.

If you ever need it, I can sell you a set of computers cheap.

Originally Posted by OttawaGeorge

Hi guys, I’m short on time today to search and consolidate the info from posts...hope someone who knows these issues well can help me out before Honda does something I wouldn’t want them to…

I dropped my 2000 off for a free Honda inspection this morning and they notified me the car has three recalls outstanding. The campaign numbers are J70 IV-07-01, K43 IV-7-06, K66 V-5-07. I popped my VIN into the Honda recall webpage and they showed 2 product updates: Insight control units and software update.

I remember reading one of these changes the charging profile and kills the FE, can someone quickly provide the pros and cons to these recalls/updates?

Thank you!
George

[AbCaRed00]

According to available records I got to that were with my car at purchase, my 2000 Insight, almost four years ago in March '08, threw a P0420 code and had the catalytic converter replaced on warrantee amd as it turned out got a free ECU per service bulletin. [ A new O2 sensor was replacedat the same time and charged for extra to the owners].
The dealer noted a recall to replace the original ECU with:
CPU 37820-PMH-506
per V-5-07 Bulletin
which was indicated "to prevent catalytic converter damage"
beside the references was 'DC 5PW CC K66 Recall.'

fwiw: with this ecu replaced at the behest of V-5-07 / K66 Recall, the vehicle was still getting [somewhat worrisome] excessive charging with a frozen battery, albeit at -25C to -30C range. The battery was likely froze stiff all the worse parked outside in the wind. Warmer temps arose to -10C, then there were no issues with the IMA other than restricted regen and assist at the start until the car/battery warmed, then all is normal.
[4 bars was typically charging for a long time in the extreme cold with 20 Bars SoC shown on the cluster. One fellow with the same symptoms years ago reported 195V in this forum.]

Now with an OBDIIC&C installed I see that the battery will charge to maximum 75% SoC [75.6% briefly on one occasion] maximum vs. the higher voltages [80%] reported for others.
I've seen a wide range in Voltages ranging from an lowest momentarily of 133V on a deep discharge/long pull with no letup, bouncing up to 150 and rebuilding, and going back the other way I saw indicated 186V going downhill.[with full to medium regen]
__________
Happenstance perhaps, but when I had 133V the SoC was around 70%; and when 186V the SoC was only registering 50%.
Funny thing that occurs about those two ranges is that the product of the SoC times the Volts [=energy??] in each case is very similar. ie. 133x.7=93.1 'units' ; vs. 186x.5=93 'units'
Hmmm. Is it supposed to equate that way, or is that just a coincidence?

[AbCaRed00]

According to available records I got to that were with my car at purchase, my 2000 Insight, almost four years ago in March '08, threw a P0420 code and had the catalytic converter replaced on warrantee amd as it turned out got a free ECU per service bulletin. [ A new O2 sensor was replacedat the same time and charged for extra to the owners].

Also at the same time the dealer noted a recall to replace the original ECU with:
CPU 37820-PMH-506
per V-5-07 Bulletin
which was indicated "to prevent catalytic converter damage"
beside the references was 'DC 5PW CC K66 Recall.'

fwiw: with this ecu replaced at the behest of V-5-07 / K66 Recall, the vehicle was still getting [somewhat worrisome] excessive charging with a frozen battery, albeit at -25C to -30C range. The battery was likely froze stiff all the worse parked outside in the wind. Warmer temps arose to -10C, then there were no issues with the IMA other than restricted regen and assist at the start until the car/battery warmed, then all is normal.
[4 bars was typically charging for a long time in the extreme cold with 20 Bars SoC shown on the cluster. One fellow with the same symptoms years ago reported 195V in this forum.]

Now with an OBDIIC&C installed I see that the battery will charge to maximum 75% SoC [75.6% briefly on one occasion] maximum vs. the higher voltages [80%] reported for others.
I've seen a wide range in Voltages ranging from an lowest momentarily of 133V on a deep discharge/long pull with no letup, bouncing up to 150 and rebuilding, and going back the other way I saw indicated 186V going downhill.
__________
Happenstance perhaps, but when I had 133V the SoC was around 70%; and when 186V the SoC was only registering 50%.
Funny thing that occurs about those two ranges is that the product of the SoC times the Volts [=energy??] in each case is very similar. ie. 133x.7=93.1 'units' ; vs. 186x.5=93 'units'
Hmmm. Is it supposed to equate that way, or is that just a coincidence?

[Hybrid-Battery-Repair]

Originally Posted by AbCaRed00

fwiw: with this ecu replaced at the behest of V-5-07 / K66 Recall, the vehicle was still getting [somewhat worrisome] excessive charging with a frozen battery, albeit at -25C to -30C range.

But that is a different campaign (not recall) and a different computer. The -010 BCM (in the back) was replaced because of this. It has nothing to do with the ECM (under the passenger's feet). The ECM recall was due to the ECM being overly sensitive to the catalytic converter's condition and throwing premature P0420 codes.

[AbCaRed00]

Thanks Ron for the clarification. I'll have to see what I've got under the back when I put in Mike's charger.
I'll try and find out what's been done to the vehicle in the way of upgrades/recalls from Honda and will record any numbers in the google module spreadsheet.
Is there a free source to download the various service bulletins/recalls or list compiled for the first gen cars?
I guess my observation would properly be stated: when it gets really cold there's not much can be done for electrolyte's freezing. I just turned on all the accessories in an attempt to use up the high amount of current going in.

[Hybrid-Battery-Repair]

Originally Posted by AbCaRed00

Is there a free source to download the various service bulletins/recalls or list compiled for the first gen cars?
I guess my observation would properly be stated: when it gets really cold there's not much can be done for electrolyte's freezing. I just turned on all the accessories in an attempt to use up the high amount of current going in.

I'm sorry, but I don't know anyplace to get TSBs free other than here.

When cold, the BCM sends charge pulses into the battery in order to warm it up from the inside out and thaw the electrolyte. The differences are that the newer ones don't risk damaging the battery.

Why don't you trade BCMs with Bob D.? He wants a 010 and has a later BCM.