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Discussion Starter #1
Is it just me or is it hard to match the 40 mpg EPA rating in the city? It seems like if I have the A/C on and am driving on the slower edge of "normally"--meaning, other cars beat me off the stop lights, etc., and I'm braking somewhat carefully--I can barely reach the 40 mpg estimate. In fact, it seems like most of the time, it's closer to 30-35 mpg.

This is kind of disappointing to me, because the Insight really only makes sense as a car if it can at reach, at a minimum, the EPA ratings.

Highway, I don't really have a big problem reaching 45mpg or more, but it seems to be so variable depending on whether you have your headlights on, wipers on, and which way the wind blows, which is very annoying.
 

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Welcome to the world of ultra efficient vehicles, where every environmental nuance makes itself known.

You can't expect EPA ratings with accessories like the A/C running.

Us gen1 Insight owners have been worrying about which way the wind is blowing since 2000. ;)
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Welcome to the world of ultra efficient vehicles, where every environmental nuance makes itself known.

You can't expect EPA ratings with accessories like the A/C running.
Why not? They test it with the AC running!
 

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They do? I guess I wasn't aware of that. Must be the new fancy ratings. My bad.
 

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Depending on your cars setup and driving arrangement it can be way lower than epa. After all epa is tested on a closed loop track. I recall from another post you may drive through the DC area. I was on the beltway once, I traveled 5 miles in an hour. I would be tickled pink to average 30mpg with the ac on. :D
 

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Welcome to the world of ultra efficient vehicles, where every environmental nuance makes itself known.
Amen to that.

Keep in mind that all of the variables that contribute to lowered MPG's apply to non-hybrids as well. You just notice them now because you're actually paying attention to fuel consumption. Mileage will decrease in city driving with A/C on in a non-hybrid too. At the end of the day you are still ahead of the game compared to most non-hybrids.

As for city driving; try to time the lights so you don't have to stop at all. Most places will have a "sweet spot" speed where you can make most of the lights without stopping at all. Of course that doesn't work everywhere or everyday...

Regarding EPA estimates; IIRC the Insight is rated at about 41MPG overall, so if you get 45MPG highway and 35MPG city that seems fairly close too me.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Depending on your cars setup and driving arrangement it can be way lower than epa. After all epa is tested on a closed loop track. I recall from another post you may drive through the DC area. I was on the beltway once, I traveled 5 miles in an hour. I would be tickled pink to average 30mpg with the ac on. :D
Haha, this is true, but my average speed this tank is 29 mph and I am averaging about 41-42 mpg on this tank. That is with about 70% of my commute being unrestricted highway driving at 60 mph, and 30% being "city" driving, with crawling along the highway at 10-15 mph with lots of stopping and going, traffic lights, etc.

I don't have any trouble reaching the EPA city mileage estimates with the A/C on and driving with my other cars.
 

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AC is a fuel burner especially on small engines it eats much power and increasing fuel consumption is more noticable than on bigger engines; i have a 3cyl./47kW but 1100kg car and in sommer i really get hot fingernails of switching AC on/off every time when push on.....I´ve put a sticker over the AC button "Turbo" :D

Honda should offer a Solarroofpanel perhaps in replacement for the useless flat rearscreen; could be a nice idea for modification makers ;)
 

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Is it just me or is it hard to match the 40 mpg EPA rating in the city? It seems like if I have the A/C on and am driving on the slower edge of "normally"--meaning, other cars beat me off the stop lights, etc., and I'm braking somewhat carefully--I can barely reach the 40 mpg estimate. In fact, it seems like most of the time, it's closer to 30-35 mpg.

This is kind of disappointing to me, because the Insight really only makes sense as a car if it can at reach, at a minimum, the EPA ratings.

Highway, I don't really have a big problem reaching 45mpg or more, but it seems to be so variable depending on whether you have your headlights on, wipers on, and which way the wind blows, which is very annoying.

How long is your drive (in miles, one-way)? And do you start out in city driving for the first mile or more of your route? Many hills on the way? Many stops on hills? Many long stops (over 2 minutes at a time?)

Do you find that your car does not go into auto-stop much, or if it does it doesn't stay auto-stopped for long?

How many miles do you have on the car? Is it still breaking in?
 

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Circa,

Do you have a MT or a CVT? I've got a manual and because the gears are so tall I've often thought that a CVT might have an advantage over the MT if running the AC because it has endless gear ratios. I'm constantly watching my ASSIST gauge when driving with AC because it drags down the engine so much that I'll be using assist and won't even realize it and then my battery runs low which forces regen and even more drag on the engine.

With Phoenix starting to hit over 100 degrees every day now I've just come to the stark reality that for the next 4-5 months my MPG are going to suck. But like someone said earlier it is still better then pretty much everything else out there.

Edit: Ah, saw this post from Active topics so didn't realize it was from G2 land, so you must have a CVT, still think CVT would have an advantage over tall gears in G1 manual transmission when running AC.
 

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Ive been driving with no regards to economy in city and highway with my phev kit. I get way better mpg on highway vs city. 73 vs 54.

It wasnt until I quit using the auto feature did I start toget supreme fuel economy.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I guess the difference is that in the Insight (and perhaps other hybrids), there is no alternator powering the accessories--it takes the power from the IMA battery (or at least it uses IMA battery power to charge the accessory battery).

In a normal ICE car, the alternator is always charging the accessory battery.

Seems to me the engine would also take longer to warm up than a normal ICE car because the engine is always shutting off.

My commute is about 25 miles each way, but it's not my commute that I'm complaining about. It's the city driving that occurs when I run errands. Usually those are within 3-5 miles of my origin. I guess I really don't have much to complain about at 35 mpg--who knows how much gas mileage a traditional ICE car would get in the city vs. EPA rating.
 

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Cobb, you're able to get 73MPG highway in the Insight2?

/faints

As far as the alternator talk, I don't really know what that has to do with city mileage.

If your runabouts are 3-5 miles, that will obliterate your fuel economy. My commute to work is 1.9 miles. That combined with the cold winter months netted me my worst tank ever - 38.8MPG(1st gen Insight).
 

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Short trips will kill the mpg for any car. I plan out my trips to the farthest first, then work my way back.

Yeah, a phev kit is the way to go baby.







 

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Once my car was warmed up and the phev pack was charged, I went out for a cup of coffee down the road. This is the shortest trip I had ever made with my i2. I worked ev mode as much as possible to get it like this and went no faster than 35mph.

 

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Ahh, I see.

Hmmm... I wonder what I could do with a PHEV kit....

 

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50.5 mpg, MID indicated, for some 17,000 miles

FWIW: been lurking over this forum for one year now. lots and lots of good mpg driving tips from the insight2 folks here! have been averaging 60+ mpg on the MID trip meter, each start-up, now for the last couple of months. seems like the I2 forum guru/enthusiast wisdom is becoming second nature to my driving: i do live in flat, flat florida; drive mostly in the suburbs; my car engine feels like it has has finally broken in after 15k miles; and my wife swears my personality has changed drastically--no more cursing out other drivers; i tend to my own traffic flow business and am slowly becoming "one with the vehicle."

at the moment, we are in stormy tennessee, and have gained the last .4 mpg on the trip, despite the hills and the load of goodies for the grandkids. who knew flat land was a state of mind named florida?

at age 75, i jes love this li'l white fuel sipper hatchback!!
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Cobb, is there a thread that shows your exact setup? My Insight is leased, so I would not want to do anything that could not be reversed, and/or has the potential to damage the vehicle in any way.
 

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Its a broad learning curve. I maybe getting close to it, but I am at 42 thousand miles already.

The phev kit is connected to the top of the hybrid battery and the accessory fuse of the fuse box. The guts of it sits in the trunk, a small extension cord runs up to the grill. Its a fairly universal kit that could work on a range of hybrid vehicles if not a 5th wheel or small ev. I am sure it would have a good resale value.

The only down side it can throw a check engine code, but those are easily cleared with any engine code scanner.
 

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I have been averiging 50.4 with only about 5,000+ miles on mine on the 25 mile commute on city streets going to work. And on the way home in HOV lane, average 50. I too have learned how to control my emotions and "lead" foot with this car. Hoping to get it up to the 60's soon. :)

Bob
 
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