Honda Insight Forum banner

1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
536 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Aptera is closer to production with a cash injection of 24 million from Google and idealab.
Good to see this latest news which will no doubt speed up the intro of production cars from Aptera.Their production plans for the type one pure EV version with 120 mile range is Dec and projected price is $27,000.
The plug in hybrid is planned for intro a year later.
They seem to be sensible in explaining the mpg figure for the hybrid by considering the increasing use of the ICE as the range extends.Most others have plucked the max figure to advertise without explaining the decrease in mpg as the ICE kicks in more often to keep the charge up.
From Their info....
As you drive further the battery energy is depleted and the engine is turned on with increasing frequency, which uses more and more fuel. The result is that on a 75 mile trip, the fuel economy of the Typ-1 PHEV is around 400 miles per gallon and on a trip of 120 miles, fuel economy is around 300 miles per gallon.

After 350-400 miles at highway speeds the fuel economy settles in at around 130 MPG, where it stays until it is charged up again. Aptera has chosen the 300 mpg/120 mile range number because they say that a 120 mile range covers the typical daily driving needs of 99% of the US population.


DGate
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,948 Posts
IS on my short list for my next mode of personal transportation too. :idea:

Unfortunately, their being stick-in-the-mud's about selling out of their planned distribution area. :roll:

Even if you "sign-up" your $500 is cheerfully refunded on their next purge cycle. :x
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
536 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
What you need is a friend in California that would provide an address for you.
Looking at it another way at least they are being honest and reasonable,a lot of start ups would just take your money without any intention or ability to deliver.

DGate
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
232 Posts
Since I'm in CA, i'm in luck for a change!

It looks very cool! A cross between a motorcycle, a car and an airplane.

I think I would prefer the hybrid model as my driving often takes me on trips of 300 miles or more. I'd consider putting down a deposit, but think I'll wait for a few more specifics about the hybrid . Since it's not due out till sometime in 2010 ( ?) there's no need to be in a rush.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
536 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
Insightful Trekker wrote......(And if your outside their distribution area, when you need parts)...

You wouldn't be buying a Chevy.....as an early adopter this is one of the things a person has to accept just as owners of antique and classic cars do.
If living near the main dealer had been my only requirement for choosing a car through the years I would have missed out owning many unusual cars.
I can see the logic of a new company staying local for its first deliveries,maybe its being over cautious but better to err on the side of caution and grow solidly than go all out nation wide and fail.
There would be increased logistical problems to contend with which a new company does not need,I think they are being sensible and this earns my trust more than a lot of hype that probably wouldn't produce results.

DGate
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
536 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Thats interesting we own an earth friendly car that has an unfriendly carbon footprint where parts are concerned,its laughable isn't it :?

DGate
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,948 Posts
james said:
That's what FedEx is for :)
Yup :!:

That would work, assuming that Aptera's narrowly focused business model would perform that function. I mean really, once you circumvent their limited distribution area the cat's out of the bag. (You really don't live os So Cal or bought with the fore knowledge that you wouldn't be there for long).

Ok so maybe they _have_ to ship you parts under some Federal fair trade law etc., but they don't have to do it promptly. :roll: Could become a real nightmare. Guess we won't really know until somebody tries... :badgrin:

Yes, I'd be willing, able, and _happy_ to assume all maintenance and repair functions. But I will also need to be able to depend on it as a primary mode of transportation. Wouldn't take much foot dragging by Aptera in shipping parts to force it to become a secondary mode of transportation. :(

Good thing Honda recently announced increased hybridization of their fleet, and the Insight's replacement. Opens up the choices a wee bit more. Buy a newer hybrid and electrify the old Insight or Civic.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
536 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
John you really sound down on the Aptera folks just because they won,t accomodate you or for that matter a big percentage of the country by setting up a national distribution system and producing thousands of cars in readiness for intro day.
Sounds like its not the car for you...too many compromises you would have to accept,waiting for parts "if needed" etc....best stick with major manufacturers with dealers in your locale. ;)

With over 3300 deposits accepted, presumeably in California, it will be some time before the rest of us get a chance.
Especially since the car is a composit structure which is slower to build than one stamped out and welded by robots.

You can bet there will be some enterprising individuals in the rest of the country that will have put down deposits in an underhanded way to accquire one or to speculate for profit. :shock:

DGate
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
495 Posts
Insightful Trekker said:
... maybe they _have_ to ship you parts under some Federal fair trade law etc., but they don't have to do it promptly. ...Could become a real nightmare. Guess we won't really know until somebody tries...

Good thing Honda recently announced increased hybridization of their fleet, and the Insight's replacement. Opens up the choices a wee bit morte. Buy a newer hybrid and electrify the old Insight or Civic.
As for shipping parts out of the California area, odds are they will be somewhat slow about it at least at first; learning curve. But slow on purpose? I doubt that - at this point managment at Aptera has too much at stake to engage in that kind of "big three type" customer contempt.

On this end, all else equal, at this point in time the Aptera is clearly on my list as a replacment for the Insight when the ole "Silver Bullet" starts to degrade.

You made mention of "Insight's replacement" ... Is there one at present? Last I heard, no but electrifying an old Civic is not such a bad idea when you first think about it - except that if it hasn't already, the body will rust but an excellent alternative as I know and understand it would be to take one of Robert Q. Reily's Urba series plan sets, build the fiberglass body and then do to it what those people at Tesla are doing with the fiber/carbon bodies they're working with. Those NmHI batteries are no longer "rare" or all that hard to get - note I didn't say cheap - but when you think about it, with one of those Reily bodies and a "box full" of NmHI cells in it, with present day gasoline prices in mind, the economics just may be there - right now.

Fred / Proud Owner of "The Silver Bullet"
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,819 Posts
Insightful Trekker said:
Good thing Honda recently announced increased hybridization of their fleet, and the Insight's replacement.
I must have missed the announcement of an actual replacement for the Insight :-( Sure, they may be recycling the NAME, but on a 4-seater. That's no replacement.

As far as Aptera replacement parts, how much would you actually need to order from them? As I understand it, they're not doing their own engines or anything like that, just using off-the-shelf components. So if you need a part for the engine, say, you go direct to the manufacturer.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,948 Posts
Dgate said:
John you really sound down on the Aptera folks just because they won,t accomodate you or for that matter a big percentage of the country by setting up a national distribution system and producing thousands of cars in readiness for intro day.
Sounds like its not the car for you...
Ah ha, the voice of reason again. ;) But its only reasonable if your are willing to accept the initial premises at face value. Sorry. I'm an atheist in this reguard. :badgrin:

/Rant on

I _was_ Aptera #1891. Nowadays a "national" parts distribution system needs to be no more than an adequately staffed shipping department and accounts with UPS & FedEx. Not exactly "high" tech or a large overhead venture.

If anybody outside their "dealer" network wants one a simple disclosure statement is all thats needed, repairs will be DIY etc. Like the Tesla or any other small start-up, an educated buyer _needs_ to know about what "exotic" means by definition.

IMO it reads to me like they just don't want to go to this relatively _small_ amount of extra effort. And in doing so will alienate some of their most dedicated potential customers.

Supply and demand you say will save them? Well maybe so given our energy future. But IMHO theres a fine line between caution and arrogance in this reguard. Corporate cultures are formed early in a company's life and are increasingly impossible to change with growth. And its was a type of corporate arrogance that has ultimately gotten the "Big 3" into their current problems. (I have a great Uncle that was in the upper circle of management of one of the Big 3 auto manufactures back in the 50's, I've heard stories from an inside perspective).

/End rant

For the record _if_ it is a form of arrogance, Aptera has only shown the most polilte form in declining me as a potential customer.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
495 Posts
Insightful Trekker said:
... Aptera has only shown the most polilte form in declining me as a potential customer.
Could be you were a little too demanding? Keep in mind and for want of a better term, they're "just getting started." At present and in the truest sense of the word, Aptera is a new car company. A lot time, talent and treasure has already been expended on the car (design, production and sales marketing) and odds are, as a new car company they have a sold fix on their target; they know what they have to offer and the type/class of customer they're going after and as such Aptera's management may at this time be, if you don't like what we have to offer, know that it's the best we can do for now.

tyc
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,948 Posts
Me :?: Naaa

All I wanted was to giv'em the money and drive away the car. With a reasonable expectation that I could order parts and have them shipped out of their area.

IMO we're slicing the "demanding" term very finely here. And its equally a fine line to slice for them not to expect "complaints" in this reguard.

But its their prerogative to _try_ and limit access to their product. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
495 Posts
Insightful Trekker said:
All I wanted was to giv'em the money and drive away the car.
From visiting their web site several times, I gathered that at the earliest, they wouldn't be ready to deliver either of their models until about now or near the end of this year.

As one who lives in the Northeast, the idea of ripping one or both of those wheel pants off in only six inches or so of snow (and such snow falls are quite common here in the Winter) that was and remains the only strike I have so far against the Aptera and odds are those people at Aptera will come up with a reasonable "fix" in that regard.

As side from that, I wish them only the very best, every success with that little car, just as I wish Honda only the very best with that FCX, which as I understand it is out now - or am I wrong? Gotta admit though, with Honda's recent advertising, which is pretty bad, they should have shown just the car - and emphasised how quiet it is - not a bunch of goof ball actors playing with water pistols and the like; some really dumb advertising if there ever was such a thing, but then that's just my opinion.

Fred / Proud Owner of "The Silver Bullet"
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top