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Discussion Starter #1
Bit late posting news again but I'm pretty impressed. 2 Honda Engineers guided the Civic Tourer 1.6 iDTEC to victory in the 2014 MPG marathon on an over 300 mile real world course. They got 97.92 mpgUK (81.5 mpgUS or 2.88 l/100km).

The Civic Tourer was one of the larger and heavier cars in the competition, making the win all the more impressive.

MPG Marathon 2015 - Honda drivers win 2014 MPG Marathon title in photo-finish
 

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That doesn't surprise me at all, My Yaris d4d will get 70mpg without too much effort at 60mph on a run, and that's 11 years old now already, and has become more economical with age I think.

The main benefit here is that this is an example where good mechanical engineering proves that aggressive weight reduction is not necessarily the most important factor to fuel economy. There is a magical mix of optimal gearing and torque that some diesels achieve (again by good design), leading to incredible real world fuel economy - and the lack of needing to concentrate too much, unlike a hybrid.

I have been saying that the 1.6 Civic tourer DTEC is probably the finest car on the market for a while now, it's a genuine all-rounder, and likely future classic (if the old Accord Aerodeck was anything to go by). Unfortunately the EU seem to be set on targeting and taxing everything diesel, so I doubt there will be any renaissance with a huge amount of longevity.

I would have one now, but I wouldn't spend £20K on a family car. Once they are down to £8-10K I may consider it.

There is one issue that is never mentionned, and that is that while the DTEC might trump any hybrid on the motorway, it wont in town, and modern diesels with particulate filters (Euro 6 complaint ones more so), are not suited to sustained urban use at all - whereas a hybrid is happy wherever.

Also, consider the price premium for diesel, and you can drop about 8-10mpg off that, and diesel is likely to be subject to increasing tax in the future.

... all that said, that's a lovely car, and I would swap the I2 in for one any time.

For our friends accross the pond: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_emission_standards

Though it's a load of figures, the attainment of particulate and NOx compliance for diesels has been a major headache for manufacturers, and many have not produced reliable options due to the particulate filters now fitted.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diesel_particulate_filter
 

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We cant have it here in the US :(
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Just a comment on the 1.6 idtec in traffic. I had a lift to work in one when my I2 was last at the dealer.

Slight, uphill, stop - start / crawling traffic on a slight uphill and the instantaneous MPG on the Mid was reading 45-50mpgUK. It's got stop-start too.

On that basis, I think it might even do better than the I2 in urban conditions
 

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Just a comment on the 1.6 idtec in traffic. I had a lift to work in one when my I2 was last at the dealer.

Slight, uphill, stop - start / crawling traffic on a slight uphill and the instantaneous MPG on the Mid was reading 45-50mpgUK. It's got stop-start too.

On that basis, I think it might even do better than the I2 in urban conditions
You could be right.
 

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WTF. I want one of these!! U.S seriously needs to get off their *** let me have my diesel civic. They let trucks that get 8mpg city have diesel (looking at you Ford powerstroke) why can't I have my 80mpg diesel civic >:/.
 

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Tim, you should drive a Jetta TDI sportwagon sometime. Honda is not the only maker of FINE diesels. VW has been in the game for a long time. But, yes, we could be achieving a lot better mpg, if people realized the true value and potential of the diesel engine. Having said that, all the latest gas engines are pretty remarkable in their fuel efficiency.
Looking at the numbers of hybrids being produced and sold now, it would lead one to believe that a diesel hybrid may offer the best of both worlds; for now. jim
 

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americans won't buy diesel slugs, they want inefficient gas burners that accelerate when you stomp on the gas. manufacturers know this which is why 99% of cars are sold with gasoline engines, trucks however are a different story... yet they just slap a turbo on the trucks and call it a day which results in a more gasoline like acceleration at the cost of fuel consumption.

i've always wanted a euro diesel sedan, but we don't really have that option here in the states. even the old 1980's vw diesels rabbit/jetta fetch a premium. and those don't even hold a candle to a insight G1 for economy.

i had a 1982 Mercedes 300TD that got about 35mpg but it was literally a rolling brick and was quite inefficient, although the reliability was top notch.
 

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WTF. I want one of these!! U.S seriously needs to get off their *** let me have my diesel civic. They let trucks that get 8mpg city have diesel (looking at you Ford powerstroke) why can't I have my 80mpg diesel civic >:/.
Tim, before we see that happening we have to get our politicians out of the oil companies beds. I'd imagine that's the only reason the top mpg cars are not here.
 

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Tim, you should drive a Jetta TDI sportwagon sometime. Honda is not the only maker of FINE diesels.
Volkswagen is in the bottom 10 for engine reliability. Even TDI owners acknowledge the problems (failing fuel pumps, damaged camshafts, exploding injectors). VW used to be the only diesel sedan/wagon in America, but now we have the choice of Chevrolet Cruze. I drove it and loved it.

I should also mention the 1.0 liter Ford which gets insight-like economy without need of emissions failure & battery replacement.
 
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