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Discussion Starter #1
I was looking in my service manual for my 2001 CVT and noticed in the fluids sections it didn't list the type of coolant the car uses. I assume it is a silicate free type. Anyone know the number?

I do all my own service on my cars so if I can buy a coolant brand other than Honda's, I will as long as it's approved for use in my car. I like to keep my operating costs down, plus I learn more about my cars this way.
 

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Discussion Starter #2
I just found this on InsightCentral's site. Please tell this isn't correct.

"Replace coolant After first 120,000 mi / 192,000 km / 10 years
Then every 60,000 mi / 96,000 km / 5 years thereafter"


They are kidding right? 10 years for coolant use before changing it!
 

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For "severe service" or "normal service" replace the coolant at 45,000 miles or 60 months, whichever comes first. (Honda ECM)

Always use Genuine Honda Antifreeze/Coolant. Using a non-Honda coolant can result in corrosion, causing the cooling system to malfunction or fail. For best corrosion protection, the coolant concentration must be maintained year-round at 50% minimum. Coolant concentrations less than 50% may not provide sufficient protection against corrosion or freezing. Coolant concentrations greater than 60% will impair cooling efficiency and are not recommended. Do not use additional rust inhibitors or anti-rust products; they may not be compatible with the coolant. (Honda ECM)
 

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Discussion Starter #4
The only reason Honda says to use their coolant is to get your money. My understanding is Honda coolant is just silicate free. Almost all new cars use this now. So what is another brand of Honda spec coolant? I don't need a quote from a service manual.
 

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For "severe service" or "normal service" replace the coolant at 45,000 miles or 60 months, whichever comes first. (Honda ECM)

Doesn't that quote help?
 

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Honda coolant (not a quote from a service manual)

"I was looking in my service manual for my 2001 CVT and noticed in the fluids sections it didn't list the type of coolant the car uses. I assume it is a silicate free type. Anyone know the number?"

Resist,

Do you mean the part number? The only number I can find on the container (right below the bar code at the bottom of the label) is OL999-9001. The other place that numer shows up is at the top right hand corner of the back label right above "Made in the USA".

This is Honda Genuine (HG) antifreeze/coolant Type 2. (maybe that's the number you're looking for?)

"CONTAINS: Ethylene glycol 107-21-1, Water 7732-18-5, Diethylene glycol 111-46-4, Hydrated inorganic acid, Organic acid salts 532-32-1." Are those the numbers you wanted?

Hope so. The only other numbers are: "Boiling point* 268F Freezing point -34F." This is "Ready to use, Non-silicate/non-borate engine coolant. Formulated with de-mineralized water."

"PERFORMANCE: Honda TYPE 2 coolant is an ethyene glycol base product for extra long lasting aluminum component protection. Honda coolant has been developed to provide corrosion and rust protection of all cooling system components. Requires no additional corrosion inhibitors. When used as directed in Honda vehicles, this coolant will give complete protection for 5 years or 60,000 miles. No additional water is required." Information about Honda Genuine antifreeze/coolant taken from front and back labels of Honda Genuine antifreeze/coolant gallon container.

"The only reason Honda says to use their coolant is to get your money. My understanding is Honda coolant is just silicate free. Almost all new cars use this now. So what is another brand of Honda spec coolant? I don't need a quote from a service manual."

The other posters were trying to help you, Resist - no need to be snippy. Here's the info off the label, I think it's up to you to figure out which, if any, brands of coolant will suit your needs.

"They are kidding right? 10 years for coolant use before changing it!"

I didn't change coolant in my '71 LeMans for years at a time - just adjusted the ph. The anti-freeze/coolant properties don't change, the ph does.

YMMV
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Jim,

I'm looking for an equal for Honda coolant. Other coolant makers state on the containers their's is GM spec or Ford spec type coolants. That is what I want for the Honda coolant. I assume the Honda coolant is not Dex-Cool because that is orange in color.

Yes I want help in finding this but I don't want quotes from the manuals as I have already read them. I wasn't being snippy before as I just want answered what I ask...nothing more.
 

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This is kind of a sleepy thread, but I recently came across this on-line supposedly from a Honda communication to dealers:

Honda says this about silicate and borate based coolants and how bad they are for aluminum engines:

Note in their tests they had leakage in a short time with silicate based coolants, not to mention other potential problems they warn against.

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- Silicates bond to the surface of the water pump seal and act as an abrasive, causing considerable seal erosion and coolant leakage. In actual tests, the silicated coolant caused early leakage. This leakage increased dramatically until a substantial portion of the coolant had been lost. In contrast, the Honda coolant had almost no leakage through the duration of the test.

Chart here, entitled "Coolant Leakage from Water Pump Seal", showing Leaked Coolant Volume in ml as follows for each test duration in Hours:

24 hrs: Honda Coolant 0, Typical Silicated Coolant 21 48 hrs: Honda Coolant 1, Typical Silicated Coolant 36 72 hrs: Honda Coolant 2, Typical Silicated Coolant 47 96 hrs: Honda Coolant 2, Typical Silicated Coolant 55 120 hrs: Honda Coolant 2.5, Typical Silicated Coolant 56 144 hrs: Honda Coolant 3.5, Typical Silicated Coolant 57 168 hrs: Honda Coolant 4, Typical Silicated Coolant 58.8 192 hrs: Honda Coolant 6, Typical Silicated Coolant 63 200 hrs: Honda Coolant 6, Typical Silicated Coolant 64

- Silicates tend to gel and settle in the coolest parts of the cooling system, causing radiator plugging and overheating.

- Borates cause pitting corrosion on the cylinder head.

- Silicate inhibitors are difficult to stabilize and, therefore, limit coolant shelf life.

Most commercially available coolants were originally designed for cast iron engines. Silicate, an inexpensive additive, was added to coolants to prevent aluminum corrosion, but the long-term durability of the combination was not tested.

In contrast, Honda coolant was designed specifically for aluminum engines. It contains an organic corrosion inhibitor instead of silicate. This superior formula gives these advantages:

- No silicate abrasion of water pump seals. For example, these graphs show the surface roughness of two aluminum water pump seal rings. Seal A, exposed to silicated coolant, shows considerable damage. Seal B, exposed to Honda coolant, displays only minute wear.

(graphs here, showing roughness across the surface, with A a very wiggly line, and B a very smooth line)

- No plugging or overheating caused by silicate gelling.

- Excellent corrosion protection for aluminum components.

- Long-term corrosion protection for other cooling system materials (steel, cast iron, copper, solder, gaskets, seals, and O-rings).
 

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Only Honda brand is Honda spec, its proprietary. ;)

The benefits of any other non silicate "brand" will be realized over the "old" silicate formula. The differences like the cost will also probably be slight.

The premixed formulas are also preferable over the concentrates. Unless you also want to go to the expense and trouble of mixing with steam distilled water to eliminate any minerals.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Wow has this thread been going for a year already? Still haven't changed out my coolant. Guess I have no choice but to pay the dealership price for coolant. I bought this car to save money and it bothers me when I have to pay a dealership their robber prices.
 

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Well the cheapest thing to do would be don't change it. The consequences will take longer than the 10 year / 120K mile limit. But ultimately cost several times the amount of a coolant change. Coolant becomes acidic with age and _slowly_ begins to eat the cooling system from the inside out.

Or revert to the cheaper formula and change it according to the old 30K interval. Or take your risk in trying another non silicate brand (AFAIK the up front cost savings will be the least for this scenario).

Or if you really don't like dealerships that much buy from an independent specialty shop, they'll make the bigger % markup from wholesale to retail and you'll cut the dealer's profit margin.

:sigh:
 

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Honda coolant

Resist said:
Wow has this thread been going for a year already? Still haven't changed out my coolant. Guess I have no choice but to pay the dealership price for coolant. I bought this car to save money and it bothers me when I have to pay a dealership their robber prices.
Maybe you can find a good mechanic (a real mechanic - not a parts changer) who can check the ph for you and adjust it.
 

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Re: Honda coolant

There is one definitive measure of coolant acidity, check its electrical potential with a DVOM. And it will take a good mechanic to remember this obscure test (I don't). And the value is not absolute. It has to be judged based on the generally acceptable tolerance of the car your subjecting this weak acid to. What's the Insight's true tolerance :?: Its anybody's guess. But given that the only solution will be to change the coolant your only adding expense (the test). Agreed, maybe you can safely delay an otherwise too soon change, but there really isn't that much cost in a change anyway. So how much you'll save in waiting for the precise moment to change vs. the additional costs of this repeated (but low cost) test may end up flipping the savings upside down into an additional expense.

Sounds like the never ending oil change interval argument has been morphed into the great coolant change debate :!: The hairs we are splitting in the oil change arguement of increased engine service life vs. cost of additional oil changes is fine. This "hair" of coolant change maintenence cost vs. service life is even finer.

Anybody got a microscope :?: :p
 

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Discussion Starter #15
You guys are putting way to much into this thread. All I wanted was a cheaper source for coolant, other than from Honda. Now that I know this coolant does not have an equivalent and can only be purchased from a Dealership, my options have been limited. I'm sure my coolant is fine as my 2001 CVT only has 16,000 miles on it.
 

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We put Prestone in the Insight several months ago and haven't had any problems. I e-mailed them today asking about coolant for our other car (MINI Cooper S) and they said the new extended life for all models is phosphate, silicate, nitrite, and amino free. That should be good enough for any car.
 

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several months is hardly enough time to tell longer term effects... I'd like to know your results 6months/1yr from now..
 

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The silicates (silica) is nothing more than glass and is present in ordinary tap water. The problem with silicates is that they will adhere to the surfaces inside the cooling system and act as an insulator. They will build up at the areas where there is more heat. I don't know if manufacturers put silica in their coolants but they might as silica is an excellent lubricant (laundry soap is loaded with it for that reason).

I would think that Honda has a specific blend of coolant produced for the insight. I don't think PH is a specific factor but that conductivity is one factor and no silica from tap water is the other. With such a small cooling system it would not take long to cause problems. I would think that the coolant jackets are rather thin to keep weight down and having high conductivity would tend to cause galvanic corrosion rather quickly.

You probably can find a coolant that's as good or better than honda's but that would be up to the user to figure that out. A good Silicate free etheylene glycol with Distilled water (not filtered) should be cool.
 

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Thanks all, I for one found the information enlightening. Eventually I probably would have dumped some Prestone in there and though I was doing the engine a favor. :oops:
 
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