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Discussion Starter #1
I have been diagnosing some herky-jerkys in my 2000 MT. Sorry I've been so quiet on here lately.

I started with the herky-jerkys and no codes. I pulled the EGR plate, cleaned it, the motor passageways, replaced all 4 gaskets. - No Change

I pulled the EGR valve and cleaned it, noticed the gasket was missing. Replaced the gasket, and the EGR. Then got a CEL. - No Change in herky jerky.

AutoZone's code reader couldn't link to the ECU, so I couldn't pull the code. Figured it was an ID10T error with the code reading unit. Grounded pin 9 on the OBD2 and got a CEL blink code "1-2." Sure enough, that's EGR so I replaced the EGR with the Accord unit and things were fine, no codes, still jerky.

Next up I replaced the O2 sensor. Less jerky, still some.

Today I get the CEL again, take it to Advanced AutoParts, they ca't pull the code either. Grounded Pin 9 again to get "1-2" and "6-7."

Now I'm pretty sure the "No link" error they're getting on the scanner is not a coincidence ad I'm wondering if something's FUBAR with my OBDII port or the ECU.

How can I troubleshoot ECU or OBDII port drama? I followed this thread: OBDII port - accidentally shorted it. What next?, but my fuses seem fine.

Any thoughts?
 

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A couple of questions and comments.

Is the herky-jerky just in lean burn or at all high load, LB and non?

When you replaced the LB sensor, did you use the original Honda part or something else?

I have been experiencing some similar problems, with similar changes, on one of my car. Replaced a bunch of stuff, but new fuel injectors seemed to help more than anything else. I would suggest having your injectors cleaned and checked.

I have a theory that the LB herky-jerky is agrivated by compression increases from deposits in the combustion chambers of these older cars. I've changed about everything.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
It's very minor under regular load, but there's a general lack of power, it's a lot harder to get and keep the car in LB. It's mostly exacerbated by AC and rain (drag).

Injector cleaning is up next, but I really need to be able to pull those codes.

The O2 sensor was a denso match unit, but I'm going to swap the old one back in since I didn't have a CEL when it was in.

Any idea why the OBDII port isn't working with the auto store code readers?
 

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its possible one of the pins in the obd connector is pushed out/fails to make contact with the pins on the scanners. try unplugging the 2nd o2 and see if the herky jerky gets better. That sensor can read really slow and not set a code but cause poor performance.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks, I'll check the OBDII pins and try driving with an unplugged sensor.
 

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It's very minor under regular load, but there's a general lack of power, it's a lot harder to get and keep the car in LB. It's mostly exacerbated by AC and rain (drag).

Injector cleaning is up next, but I really need to be able to pull those codes.

The O2 sensor was a denso match unit, but I'm going to swap the old one back in since I didn't have a CEL when it was in.

Any idea why the OBDII port isn't working with the auto store code readers?
I'm having this same problem with my Honda Civic HX. I have done the same exact things to try and fix the problem to no avail. As a last ditch effort I poured a 20oz bottle of Techron in my last fill up and have gone through half the tank. My idle definitely improved. I'll let you know of if it helps with the herky jerky.

Forgot to mention, I have no CEL codes, or even trouble codes for that matter (I have a ultragauge).
 

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I have been diagnosing some herky-jerkys in my 2000 MT....
No thoughts on the OBD port -- check the connector, make sure the pins are tight... Have you checked your grounds and spark plugs lately - for the herky jerky?
 

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Discussion Starter #8
I'm going to check the pins on the OBDII this weekend and see how it looks. Is there troubleshooting in the FSM for the OBDII port? I didn't see anything.
 

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look on pg 11-39 in the FSM. it shows the pin out locations of the data link connector. also, look for a black wire from there-it connects to ground, it might be loose.

Ive not found anything on the DLC for issues in the book (so far), so at this time its a visual check/multi meter-continuity thing looking for shorts ect.
Just throwing this out there, maybe the scanners were set to a wrong setting (like GM, ford) and couldnt/wouldnt read the ECM because it was the wrong car. If you can, buy a cheepo scanner so it will help in TS the plug and save trips to the auto store.
 

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If you want to rule out your EGR valve unplug it and then drive the car under same conditions. If it drives good then your egr valve is bad. I had this problem in one of my insights. I repaired my egr valve by flipping the fingers that wipe on the carbon tracks. But you can also buy a 99 accord egr valve that supposedly works just as good.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I was finally able to check the OBDII connectors and it looks fine. Only 6 wires, all the pins are all the way in.

I flipped through the FSM and did search of the same, didn't see if there was a diagnosis procedure for the OBDII connector.

Anyone know if such a thing exists? Any of you OBDII interface guys seen this issue before where the code reader can't get a link?

Regarding the herky-jerky: I replaced the EGR, the O2 sensor, spaced the O2 sensor, cleaned the EGR passageways, and am taking the injectors to InjectorRX today to have them tested, benchmarked, cleaned and re-tested.

Next up is a compression test, valves, and the VTEC filter. Plugs are newish but I'll visually inspect when I do the compression test. I don't expect the valves to help anything, just want to adjust them since they're a little too chatty.
 

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OBD Connector

Have you verified there is actually 12v power at the OBDII connector relevant pins?
+12v at Pin 16 & Gnd at Pin 5 If you put a 12v bulb across pin 16/5 does it light?

I appreciate you have checked fuses.

With a meter check the below.

The KLine pin 7 should show 12v
The HLine pin 14 should show 5V
The SCS Pin 9 should show 5V IIRC
 

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Discussion Starter #13
That's the stuff! I'll bust out the voltage tester and give that a go. I checked the fuses that seemed relevant, are there specific ones for the OBDII port? All the voltage checks with the key in the Run (II) position?
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I had the injectors of an undetermined age tested, cleaned, and refurbished.



The results on paper don't seem overwhelming, but I'll take it for a drive and check back.

I have to find my voltage tester, I think it's buried somewhere. Might be a weekend project to keep diagnosing the OBDII port, thanks for all the help.
 

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There are two O2 sensors on this car, right? Have you checked out the other one?

I would look at and unplug/re-plug the connectors at the ECU. If you have a working ECU available you can swap it out to help diagnose the problem.
 

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There are two O2 sensors on this car, right? Have you checked out the other one?
depends on year. '00 had only 2 unless you do the recall and they install the 3rd. Im not sure what years after 00 they did 3 from factory-02 on i think.
 

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00 to mid 01 had 2 sensors, from then on three. I don't remember and haven't seen a recall on installing a third sensor?

HTH
Willie
 

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id have to find them-i received 3 recalls (one was the window switch). The first fix was the reprogrammed ecm (the over active cat code) and then the 3rd sensor with new ecm recall. Being the conspiracy type person that I am, i did neither (thinking that the new stuff would lower my mpgs).
 

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2001 5S "Turbo"
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There was another one on the emergency brake lever, I think.

Willie
 

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Discussion Starter #20
There are two O2 sensors on my car. The top one is a Lean-Air-Fuel sensor, a more precise O2 sensor (P/N: 36531-PHM-A02). The lower unit is a regular O2 sensor (P/N: 36531-PCC-014). On the later years there's a third O2 on the exhaust pipe under the car behind the engine compartment. I believe that sensor is also a "regular" O2, they're sold together and you should replace both at the same time so they say balanced (2005 P/N: 06365-PHM-A20).

I'm 99% sure both of my sensors are good, the LAF because it's relatively new Honda OE and the second because it wasn't throwing codes, and it's replacement with a temp unit and it's spacing from the stream didn't affect the car's condition.

A long drive last night with A/C on revealed that I still have herky jerkies and still feel as thought the car really hates lean burn. Compression test is up next, as well as the continued OBDII diagnosis. The FSM procedures for testing the components I'm tinkering with involves testing voltages and pulling codes. I feel like this is more black arts than science without the OBDII working.

Thanks for the help so far, guys. We'll get to the bottom of this. I really appreciate the advice.
 
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