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Discussion Starter #1
i've lost count of how many times i've brought my car to get an oil change and was told 0w-20 doesn't exist.. to which i turn my back and leave.. so i've gotten in the habit of purchasing mobil 1 synthetic 0w-20 AND the filter from walmart prior to taking the car in..

So i brought my car in for an oil change today.. handed over the oil and filter and was completely confused when the attendant shook his head and gave me a "you know better" look.. he then goes on to tell me they have special "hybrid oil" and that synthetics are a no-no in the hybrids... i haven't bothered googling this yet but can someone tell me what the hell he was talking about?? I politely backed out on his offering of wisdom and drove away... oil change on hold for the moment...
 

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Please don't tell me this is a dealership saying this. The only thing different about "Hybrid Oil", was the fact that it is 0W in the 0W-20 range. Otherwise there is no such thing as a special "Hybrid Oil". I'm amazed that anyone in the auto industry would advise against using synthetic oil in a vehicle.

Start changing your own oil and keep clear of those monkeys.
 

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My regular oil change place did not have any 0w and refused to put 5w mobile 1 in, saying that it would void the warranty. I had to go to the dealer to get 0w but they couldn't change the oil for 2 days so I took the dealer oil to the first place. Since they told me that they had ordered 0w oil 3 weeks before they changed the oil (that I supplied) for free.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
well good. my walkout was justified. monkeys indeed.. Honda of Oakland, CA. first and last time i step foot in there.

Regarding changing your own oil... is it necessary to lift the car on blocks to get under and have everything in reach or is it possible to simply slide under there w/o raising the car?? I'll be the first to admit i'm a computer person more than i am a car person.. but these days i guess that line is blurring.. i think you get the point. i suppose it probably shouldn't be too difficult to find a faq on DIY oil changes on this site or somewhere else...


edit - found all i needed here
 

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lakedude,

No place can refuse to change your oil because in their opinion it would void YOUR warranty. It's your choice what oil you put in and all you had to do was show them your owners manual.




robgobbler,

Have you seen how low the Insight sits to the ground? No human being could possibly get under the car without it being on ramps. Rhino Ramps from Walmart come to mind. Then you have to unbolt like 10 or 12 panel bolts to get to the oil filter. Probably only take like 30 minutes to do the complete oil change. You will get faster the more you do it.
 

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Sounds like more hybrid confusion.

And someone not communicating well.

My read is they were clumsily trying to "do the right thing" by insisting on using the recommended weight oil. But as you know the differences between 0W and 5W are slight and will not have a measurable difference except in _extreme_ cold conditions.

Definitely a walkout, but based on their novice communication skills and knowledge of lubricating oil.

The caution of using synthetics applies to switching from mineral based oils when a car has higher miles. With normal wear switching at 100K miles will likely _increase_ oil consumption (out the tailpipe) due to the characteristic of synthetics. Won't do any damage unless you let the car run out of oil. And the mile number is not an absolute.

But being prudently cautious rather than recklessly fearless is always a lower cost route :!: ;)

HTH! :)
 

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Discussion Starter #7
heh resist - thanks for pointing out what should have been obvious, my friend... if you read my post though you'll see i managed to find the answers on this site and posted the link.. it was a little late and running outside to see if i fit under my car wasn't on the top of my things to do list. i wont be surprised if you're not the last person posting the same answer however.
 

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robgobbler,

I changed oil last week with the car flat on the deck but you need long arms to do it. Also it helps if the oil drain plug has been torqued correctly so you can release it,ditto the filter.
Re:the black plastic under pan,remove four bolts and loosen the fifth at the back and lower front edge of panel and pivot on the fifth bolt till its out of the way.Easy Peasy.
Dgate
 

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Just a side note: Dont use sythetic oil in your airplane!

Mobil was sued big time by continental. Continental contracted with them for some Synthetic oil. Then all their engines seized up. SOmething about the air cooled engines using the oil to clean something. I dont rembmer the reason. But in aircraft you have to use semi-syn.

Just food for though, and completely unrelated to the hybrid issue!
 

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JustinGray said:
Just a side note: Dont use sythetic oil in your airplane!

Mobil was sued big time by continental. Continental contracted with them for some Synthetic oil. Then all their engines seized up.

Just food for though, and completely unrelated to the hybrid issue!

Gee, Justin, thanks for the tip! I'll print this thread so there will be no chance I'll forget next time I change the oil in my 747. :roll:
 

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man, i want a 747 reall bad.

Actually... the synthetic oil issue did not deal with jets, but piston engines. Continental has a small fleet of air cooled piston engine planes that is uses for short halls. These were the ones that were having problems. I suspect that most any air cooled engine would not like synthetic oil as well, but that is only a guess!
 

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JustinGray said:
Actually... the synthetic oil issue did not deal with jets, but piston engines. Continental has a small fleet of air cooled piston engine planes that is uses for short halls.
I'll make sure I don't use synthetic in all the small planes, too.
 

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This should clear things up:

Lubricants made with synthetic base oils are excellent lubricants. The problem is that synthetics are so pure that they are very poor solvents. The automotive industry has developed additive chemistry that works with the synthetic base oil to provide the cleanliness characteristics needed to maintain a clean engine. This means that if you use synthetic-based oil in your car and change it at the proper intervals, your engine should remain relatively clean and offer excellent service and life. Major problems can occur if an owner decides that since the synthetic oil is more expensive, it should last longer and they then extend their oil change intervals significantly. In these cases the oil does not wear out, but can become completely saturated with contaminates like carbon, and then excess deposits can build up.

The problem with the use of synthetics in aircraft is the leaded fuel. Synthetic-base oils are so pure that they do not absorb the lead byproducts of combustion as the mineral base oils do. In addition, because of the necessary limitations on additive chemistry in the piston engine oil specifications, many of the additives used in automotive oils can not be used in aircraft oils.

The problem is not universal. When Shell Oil started to test synthetic piston engine oils back in the 1960s, many engines performed very well on the product. Unfortunately, numerous engines, usually the larger turbocharged opposed engines, started to show signs of increased oil consumption as early as 600 hours. When these engines were disassembled, the pistons looked like someone had taken a gray epoxy and coated the entire piston ring belt and glued the rings into the piston. In addition, the props were full of the same gray sludge, which was found to be lead byproducts of combustion. Shell never marketed a full synthetic oil, however, several companies did and found out the hard way that synthetic oils do not absorb the lead byproducts of combustion.

Aviation piston engine oils are approved against a SAE/Mil specification. The full synthetic oils that were marketed met that specification. When field problems occurred, the oil companies worked with the FAA to solve the problems. However, the FAA did not rule against synthetic oils, the oil companies removed them from the market.
 

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Justin and maybe Jim; sorry to say, but you guys are all wet on this one......(I am a private & commercial rated pilot, & aviation mechanic) The CONTINENTAL referred to here, is not Continental airlines, but Teledyne-Continental Motors, Inc of Mobile, AL. They have manufactured piston aircraft engines since about 1944. It is true that in 2001 they placarded their engines against using Mobil 1 synthetic -----but not because "all their engines seized up". I don't think even 1 seized up. There were some reported problems, but you must understand the avaition industry. To avoid further multi-million $ product liability judgements, they always error toward the side of safety. If there is even a remote question, they will often "pull" a product for further testing.
Actually, I still use full synthetic in my airplane; it reduces friction!! Billy.......
 

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Air-cooled engines and synthetic

Actually, I specifically use synthetic (Mobil-1 or others) oils in my motorcycles that are air-cooled. It is best because air-cooled engines vary operating temperatures tremendously and the synthetic oil stays in the desired viscosity range much better than petroleum-based oil after the oil has some miles on it. The petroleum based oils more easily shear the hydrocarbon chains which lessens the viscosity as it is used and leads to more engine wear. Until my bikes have a few thousand miles on them I use petroleum based oil (but change it often) to allow more wear and seat the piston rings and other oil-bathed parts. Doing this gives me an engine which uses less oil over the long haul. I hope that this helps. :?
 
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