[FlyingHood395]

Here are the mechanicals that I measured.

And some additional pictures:
Blue Energy on the left (18S+), and the known 18S- on the right.

 

[FlyingHood395]

You can hook the negative lead up to "C1-" in the pinout image posted in #316. Then as you walk up the stack with the positive lead, you should see an increase of ~3.7 volts for each cell you measure (e.g. C1+ should be ~3.7 volts, C2+ should be ~7.4 volts, C3+ should be ~10.7 volts, etc).

The Blue Energy module measured exactly like this. Started at ~3.7volts on C1+ and ended at ~67.1volts at C18+. I didn't measure the resistors.

 

[mudder]

Thanks for taking all these measurements! Based on this data, it looks like these Blue Energy modules will mechanically work with LiBCM, with the following caveats:
-for now a 12S module is still required (or a 'bolted' 18S module that you then convert to 12S).
-QTY3 18S modules will eventually work with the 54S configuration... but that's still a while out, as my next project is finishing the 60S 47 Ah FoMoCo project.
-I haven't actually verified these modules contain EHW5 cells. It's possible they contain the older EH5 module, which is mechanically similar as far as I can tell. Whether or not it ultimately matters which cells are present (EHW5 or EH5) is still TBD. If there is less capacity, LiBCM can still handle that. If someone wants to send me a tab-welded 18S module, I will perform this testing (and then send it back).

Thank you @FlyingHood395 for taking the risk buying these modules.

 

[eprom]

I found a site that mentions that the EH5 (bolted) battery would have a capacity of 4.7Ah and EHW5 (welded) 5Ah.
I don't know how reliable this information is but it's interesting

GS Yuasa HEV lithium battery production doubled

www.ctechigroup.com

On this other site there are comparative graphs between EH5 vs EHW5
It would seem that the soldering batteries are a bit better than the others.
Maybe just a lower resistance inter cells due to welding

Products Information

Products Information is posted.

www.blue-energy.co.jp

 

[Recovering_Gasaholic]

The blue energy EHW5 18s welded modules have a sticker saying EHW5. Are we sure the Honda insight modules are EHW5? Does the w stand for welded?

 

[mudder]

Based on what I've found, the 'W' in EHW5 does not stand for "welded". My understanding is the EHW5 is a newer chemistry. Based on the graphs I've seen (and that @eprom reposted above), whether or not the tabs are welded isn't reflected in the model numbers "EH5" or "EHW5". For example, it wouldn't make sense that the battery performance as a function of temperature would change simply because the tabs were welded or not.

As always, I might be wrong.

 

[Recovering_Gasaholic]

Thanks for taking all these measurements! Based on this data, it looks like these Blue Energy modules will mechanically work with LiBCM, with the following caveats:

And they're gone!

 

[mudder]

And they're gone!

Great to see! I was amazed how long they stayed available for sale... at least two weeks.

 

[eprom]

wow mudder as soon as you mention that a battery is compatible with LIBCM it sells out in time
You should negotiate a price with battery hookup !
you are probably the best seller they have for some of their battery

 

[FlyingHood395]

I just hope that everyone who wants to do a lithium upgrade can, so I'm glad I was able to help in some regards. I was heartbroken when I missed the first round of batteries back in February of '21.

 

[mudder]

wow mudder as soon as you mention that a battery is compatible with LIBCM it sells out in time

I'm amazed battery hookup sold QTY400 of those 47 Ah FoMoCo batteries... not sure how many of those went to future LiBCM users.

You should negotiate a price with battery hookup !
you are probably the best seller they have for some of their battery

They actually have an affiliate network... basically I get 10% of the sale price if customers enter a keyword (e.g. 'libcm'), and the customer gets a 5% discount. However, I've hesitating doing this, as I don't want to detract from their profit margin.

 

[eprom]

I will probably convert one of my insights with your LIBCM but I am especially interested in the 47a samsung batteries which have been sold very recently.
As we don't know if it will be available soon, I wonder if with your current version of hardware, I could work with EHW5 batteries and later change to 47A batteries or will a different version be needed?
Maybe with resistors to equalize cells with a value lower than 75 ohm for larger batteries?

 

[mudder]

If you purchase LiBCM now and use it with EHW5 modules, and then upgrade to the 47 Ah modules in the future, you'll need to replace the following items:
-the BMS ribbon cables that connect to each 47 Ah module, and;
-replacement PCB for each 47 Ah module (just traces and a new connector, so cheap), and;
-whatever the new mounting solution is (probably a folded 3/16" aluminum sheet, and;
-the high current cables, since the lengths will be different.

None of these items have been designed yet, so I cannot estimate the price, but we're looking at $500 tops, where most of that cost is the folded aluminum bracket. @jime thinks it might be possible to use a flat sheet with bolted on wings, which would substantially decrease the cost. However, again, I haven't designed anything yet, so it's difficult to tell.

If you know you're going to upgrade to the 47 Ah modules in the future, then you should also purchase the upgraded grid charger now, too. It will work with either battery configuration, but is overkill for the EHW5 modules.

 

[FlyingHood395]

They actually have an affiliate network... basically I get 10% of the sale price if customers enter a keyword (e.g. 'libcm'), and the customer gets a 5% discount. However, I've hesitating doing this, as I don't want to detract from their profit margin.

Since they're selling these batteries for what we consider cheap, you could tell them which will work for your projects and have them increase the price on those by 10%. Sounds like a win win. 10% more is still a steal, may discourage scalping, and the supply should last longer.

 

[Balto]

If you purchase LiBCM now and use it with EHW5 modules, and then upgrade to the 47 Ah modules in the future, you'll need to replace the following items:
-the BMS ribbon cables that connect to each 47 Ah module, and;
-replacement PCB for each 47 Ah module (just traces and a new connector, so cheap), and;
-whatever the new mounting solution is (probably a folded 3/16" aluminum sheet, and;
-the high current cables, since the lengths will be different.

None of these items have been designed yet, so I cannot estimate the price, but we're looking at $500 tops, where most of that cost is the folded aluminum bracket. @jime thinks it might be possible to use a flat sheet with bolted on wings, which would substantially decrease the cost. However, again, I haven't designed anything yet, so it's difficult to tell.

If you know you're going to upgrade to the 47 Ah modules in the future, then you should also purchase the upgraded grid charger now, too. It will work with either battery configuration, but is overkill for the EHW5 modules.

Sorry Mudder, but overkill is underrated.

 

[Balto]

Since they're selling these batteries for what we consider cheap, you could tell them which will work for your projects and have them increase the price on those by 10%. Sounds like a win win. 10% more is still a steal, may discourage scalping, and the supply should last longer.

The end user always takes the price increase brunt. If there is demand, there will be scalpers.

 

[mudder]

The end user always takes the price increase brunt. If there is demand, there will be scalpers.

My company has had to raise our prices on nearly everything we sell this year.
Related: I will shortly raise LiBCM's price, too... that's just the way capitalism works... gotta make a profit.

 

[Balto]

My company has had to raise our prices on nearly everything we sell this year.
Related: I will shortly raise LiBCM's price, too... that's just the way capitalism works... gotta make a profit.

Can't fool me, we all know you aren't making scrap compared to the time you have into this product <3.

And prices going up? Hmm I need to order QTY2 from you beforehand. Lemme know when I can buy.

 

[mudder]

Can't fool me, we all know you aren't making scrap compared to the time you have into this product <3.

It's a labor of love. I do eventually expect to not be six figures in the red with LiBCM... in fact, the hardware breakeven point is QTY96 units... in other words, after selling QTY96 units, I will have made zero dollars designing and selling LiBCM.

I'll never recover the firmware development effort. But I was going to do it anyway, so might as well share it with the community. It's a labor of love.

And prices going up? Hmm I need to order QTY2 from you beforehand. Lemme know when I can buy.

I'll start making more DIY LiBCM Kits later this week.

 

[weldoak]

I'm beginning to think that Battery Hookup oversold the 47ah packs. I ordered just slightly over a month ago, and emailed them about a week ago (and they said my order would ship out in the next day or two). Sort of seems like they're stalling hoping to get more of them in.