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Gas Mileage

7K views 38 replies 13 participants last post by  salty1 
#1 ·
I am hoping someone can help me with this problem:
I have a 2002 Insight which I bought as a demonstrator from a dealer in August 2002;it has an automatic transmission.
When I purchased the vehicle, the mileage was 5000 and MPG for auto was around 45.
I live in western Mass., where weather can vary quite a bit.
When I purchased vehicle, the MPG continued around 45MPG, which I felt was ok but not was advertised;dealer told me it had to do with driving style, etc.
The next summer I July 2003 I drove to New York City(distance 150) without using AC and got around 58MPG for the entire trip(300 miles).
Since that time MPh has gone steadily down and sometimes gets as low as low 30's (MPG) in winter.
The mileage for entire life of car is a paltry 38.7. it has around 43 thousand miles on it.
In all fairness I retired several years ago and now average only 200 miles a week.
I have told dealer(and actually contacted Honda about this) about this and have been told it has to do with perhaps what has been added to gas, again my driving style, etc. I wasn't happy but accepted explanation.
One
One day about 3 months ago i brought my car in for service and noticed there was another Insight from my area also being serviced.
I was curious so I had a rep. check milegae for life of car;it was a 2000 Insight(manual) and has a MPG for 58 MPG with around 75 or 80000 miles on it.
I then checked with a salesman who also he had a customer with an Insight (my area also) who was also getting in high 50's.
My dealer ran some tests and said they could not find anything wrong with my vehicle.
About a month ago, I took a trip to Washington DC and averaged high 40's going down(trip is around 400 miles down).
On way back(Wash. is warmer than in Mass. )I started out great in high fifties and then mileage deteriorated a little but still around 54 for return trip.
Since I returned mileage reverted to low to mid 30's and has increased a little in between fillups to around 36 MPG or so of late with warmer weather.
I have kept logs for dealer on trips, they have told me they will contact customer reps, etc. but this goes back and forth with nothing being done.
I can't believe my driving is that different to cause a 20 MPG discrepancy between my 38.7 and others 58 MPG.
I don't speed,etc.
I love my Insight overall but feel someone must know what problem is;the car is not in warranty presently but feel Honda should consider it in warranty because I complained about this problem LONG before warranty expired.
Does anyone have any suggestions, and also please tell me your MPG on your Insight, how may miles on it, where you live, etc.
Thanks in advance.
 
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Discussion starter · #2 ·
ps the word in second last sentence should be how many miles.
Also, I use regular gas(as instructed).
My own opinion is that somehow computermis not alloting correct amount of gas.
Also, car has a strange habit of getting much better mileage right after tank is filled up than when gas in car starts to decrease after use.
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
Thanks guys for the advice.
Dougie-remember I bought the car in 2002 and not 2005;thus I know what to expect, and the bottom line is that the mileage has deteriorated and not got better as one would think it should.
I am going to ask for a meeting with an area rep. myself soon if I don't get some answers.
 
Discussion starter · #6 ·
Also, I do a lot of short trips, but again when I see others who live in same area getting a LOT better mileage (58 as opposed to 39), I have to find out what the cause is;if I got 50 and they got 58, ok. But 20 MPG difference seems a bit much for drivers operating under similar conditions.
 
Discussion starter · #8 ·
Griller-thanks.
Here is where I still find fault:
Before I retiered a few years ago, I drove more, and more highway driving, and commute to work was around 7 miles.
Even though I never got out of mid 40's for MPG for life of car and as stated it has decreased to 38.7 which is not good.
If others got the same, I could live with it, but as stated, that is not the case.
Hopefully, the dealer can resolve this issue.
 
Discussion starter · #12 ·
I would also add that that trip to New York was almsot three years ago.
I took my daughter to New Jersey last August (probably 450 miles round trip), and MPg for trips was in high 40's(AC was used a little).
As stated, in March the trip to Wash. averaged high forties down and low fifties back-ok but should be better, ESPECIALLY IMMEDIATELY after I returned to New England(somewhat cold but not bitter) and MPG sunk once again into low-mid 30's.
 
Discussion starter · #15 ·
The Service Manager called me(he is a real good guy and has helped me with a lot of things in the past) and told me that he has checked with Honda representative and that little more could be done at this point as all the tests in past had been normal.
I told him about this site, and he seemed anxious to check it out.
He gave a lot of same advice as given here, and told me that one of his customers who also drives an Insight told him to tell me to inflate tires to mid 40's(I have had them in mid to high 30's). i am goind to do this as well as have wheel alignment checked.
Oh yes-sorry if this has been asked before, but what do you guys who get great mileage use for gas-regular, regular plus, premium, and what brand? I have noticed differences in MPG between brands myself.
Stay tuned for more to come.
 
Discussion starter · #22 ·
Ok-here is the latest, and this seems to be a common problem:
I inflated the tires to around 44.
As I still have some gas left in my tank ( I would say around 60%), I set trip A to 0.
Since I filled tank up last, I have been averaging around 36.5(yeah it does suck).
Anyways, the "Trip A" reading was great for the first 5 miles or so and even reached 65).
Then, as usual as I took some short trips around town with some highway driving, the party ended and now after 60 or 70 miles or so it has gone back to 39.
Above has always been the problem:after I fill up and drive a short distance, mileage is quite good, and then mpg decreases, at first slowly and then more dramatically as there is a less and less fuel in the tank.
As stated, dealer has said all the tests they have run show nothing is wrong and since warranty is up, nothing more can be done.
I still think something is wrong when I see most everyone here getting a minimum in mid 50's and some MUCH higher.
I am going to have wheels aligned to see if that helps;somehow though i think there is something else more fundamentally wrong especially when the mileage is so low relatively speaking.
If i don't see some dramatic improvement soon, I am going to demand to meet with a customer rep. myself and show him some of the posts here as a point of reference and comparison.
I am getting irritated!
ps From another thread, I see where someone else has the same prdicament as me'it appears dealer doesn't want to deal with a possible battery problem, or the 02 sensor;could those be the cause of my problems?
 
Discussion starter · #24 ·
Thanks. I s feel getting 36-38 MPG while it may be based on the same principle that you are talking about, is a bit more serious as I have NEVER got the 70 or anything close to it that and as stated for life of car at 43 thousand miles is at 38.7. That sucks!
 
Discussion starter · #25 ·
I called Honda Headquarters today;a very nice lady took down all of my information, problems and concerns and said someone will get back to me.
I also scheduled a wheel alignment;adding airs to tires to 44 accomplished nothing.
 
Discussion starter · #27 ·
Bretthans-thanks for your insight(no pun intended).
I think if you compare the gas ratings for thje 2002 Manual and Auto, there isn't that much difference, and no where does it infer that mpg for life of car would be anywhere near 38.7 no matter what kind of driving is done.
I think in all honesty though that many of the cars on which I base my comparison are manual transmissions.
 
Discussion starter · #28 ·
It appears progress is being made. I got a call from Customer Service who asked me some questions about the car and the problem.
I mentioned a lot of what I read in this forum as verification of the problem.
The Customer rep. said he contact the local dealer and get back to me.
Well, just minutes ago I got a call from dealer to set up appointment to run some more tests next week(for Tuesday).
Stay tuned, and thanks to everyone so far who has given me his/her take and so much valuable information.
 
Discussion starter · #29 ·
Tests were done yesterday and wheels were aligned.
Nothing was found during tests to show anything wrong with my car.
I filled the car up last week with Shell premium.
I am getting 37.8 MPG on latest fillup based on less than 100 miles of driving;this is lousy considering weather has been good and fairly warm of late and no AC or much heating used.
Customer Service from Honda called me today from American Honda to tell me dealer had found nothing wrong with car.
I suggested that he be sure that OT sensor and battery had been checked;he said he would contact service dept. of dealer.
What more can I do at this point(if anything?).
 
Discussion starter · #34 ·
First of all-thanks Highwater for posting the line.
Second of all-goodnews. I just got back from the dealer, and the service manager told me that in running a new test(apparently one they didn't run yesterday) they discovered ot is not performing up to par.
They have ordered one for me;this has to be construed as good news, as things could only get better no matter what and no charge for me in any event.
Stay tuned for the next chapter when part arrives.
 
Discussion starter · #37 ·
jl47 said:
Hi,

For gas mileage, here is my (informal) checklist:

O2 sensor (this will quickly kill mileage on any car). You can get some perfectly good aftermarket ones for around $50.

EGR valve. This will also hurt gas mileage. It is an easy item to clean and/or replace. It has to do with lean burn mode. However, in a CVT Insight, it doesn't have lean burn mode-that's how it get's it's SULEV status. Manual Insight is ULEV except for 06 models, which is now SULEV I believe.

Sticking brakes/underinflated tires. Your tires can be inflated to 45 if you like. Make sure that the replacements are "low resistance" tires as it makes a difference. 10-15% in some cases. Do some research on the internet.

Buy the Honda engine heater. No car performs well in cold conditions. You can lose half your gas mileage if the engine never warms up. The heater is a must in northern climates.

Do the "warm" air intake mods. Search on here-it's a really simple thing to do. It will make the most difference on lean burn (manual) cars, but should help CVT also. Use cardboard to place in front of the radiator. Just cut a piece out of the proper size-nothing fancy. This will help out a lot in cooler weather.

Combine trips to avoid short trips. It takes about 15-20 minutes to achieve good mileage in the Insight (with the hot air mods above, this will be cut down somewhat).

Change your oil. Insist on 0w20 or min. 5w20. 0 is better. Change oil regularly. Also, use 89 gas. (I've gotten a little better mileage from it-enough to offset the cost).

Drive 55 or 60. Higher speeds=more gas. Think how you'd ride a bike. Coast to stop. Only enough energy to get up hills (i.e. don't try to speed up a hill).
Thanks so much;I am going to mention this stuff on Monday when I bring my Insight in to have the O2 sensor replaced.
 
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