[mike75bug]

Check engine light just came on the other day along with the IMA light. Would love some ideas and insight. I took it to a place that said they know Hondas including the insight well, pulled a P1568, scratched their head and said I have to go to the dealer.

Known details:
1) Driver side of engine, the second (going from top to bottom) ground cable to the engine is broken.
2) Check engine light came on with a P1568 code
3) IMA light is often on
4) If I rev the engine up high, the brake and battery lights come on and eventually go off after driving for a while.
5) Driving home from the shop I wrapped the one end of the broken ground cable to the other ground cable. The IMA light went off, it charged and assisted fine the whole way home.
6) Day after, with ground wire still wrapped around other, IMA light is back on and no charging or assisting.
7) Battery is always well charged and seems to work fine.

Could this all be from bad engine grounds?

Anyone know the part numbers for those two ground cables and is there a third somewhere I heard speak of (Can't seem to find them at hondapartsnow.com)?

Any other ideas?

Thanks,

Mike

 

[72chevel]

I had a similar code and problems after I replaced my 12 volt battery. I replaced both ground straps, I just replaced them with ground battery cables from runnings and issues went away.

 

[Hybrid-Battery-Repair]

P1568 is problem connecting to one of three things: The PTC temperature circuit (BCM), the thermistor temperature circuit (BCM), or the voltage taps to the BCM. All three are either the battery or the BCM. If you want to be adventurous and save yourself a ton of money, I can give you the testing steps (voltmeter).

Check engine light just came on the other day along with the IMA light. Would love some ideas and insight. I took it to a place that said they know Hondas including the insight well, pulled a P1568, scratched their head and said I have to go to the dealer.

Known details:
1) Driver side of engine, the second (going from top to bottom) ground cable to the engine is broken.
2) Check engine light came on with a P1568 code
3) IMA light is often on
4) If I rev the engine up high, the brake and battery lights come on and eventually go off after driving for a while.
5) Driving home from the shop I wrapped the one end of the broken ground cable to the other ground cable. The IMA light went off, it charged and assisted fine the whole way home.
6) Day after, with ground wire still wrapped around other, IMA light is back on and no charging or assisting.
7) Battery is always well charged and seems to work fine.

Could this all be from bad engine grounds?

Anyone know the part numbers for those two ground cables and is there a third somewhere I heard speak of (Can't seem to find them at hondapartsnow.com)?

Any other ideas?

Thanks,

Mike

 

[mike75bug]

It is fixed

I put in a new ground wire (the second one down from the top) and the problems went away.

I still have to work on some issues with the ICE (doesn't run as smooth and efficiently as it should), but the IMA light is off, it is charging and assisting fine, etc.

Thanks

 

[Leeper]

I replaced both ground wires myself - went to Napa and got a couple feet of braided cable and Home Depot for the ends, pounded it with a hammer and installed them. Took moments to do and costs was under $5 for both.

 

[Hybrid-Battery-Repair]

I put in a new ground wire (the second one down from the top) and the problems went away.

I still have to work on some issues with the ICE (doesn't run as smooth and efficiently as it should), but the IMA light is off, it is charging and assisting fine, etc.

Thanks

That is strange. Did you unplug your 12V battery when you worked on it? If not, then maybe the chassis ground that is used for the thermistors wasn't... grounded.

 

[mike75bug]

Not fixed

The IMA light came back on and I have the check engine light on again. I spoke too soon. I am going to try to test the sensors now.

 

[talonmike]

Did you replace the negative wire of the 12v battery?

 

[mike75bug]

Yup-replaced the 12v negative wire

Did you replace the negative wire of the 12v battery?

Yes, I replaced two ground straps (driver's side of engine) and the negative wire for the 12v battery. I did not do a BCM reset afterwards though. I am going to do that after work today. Tried yesterday but I didn't have the directions then and could not find the fuse (I forgot it was the under the dash panel, not under the hood).

 

[joecvt]

Yes, I replaced two ground straps (driver's side of engine) and the negative wire for the 12v battery. I did not do a BCM reset afterwards though. I am going to do that after work today. Tried yesterday but I didn't have the directions then and could not find the fuse (I forgot it was the under the dash panel, not under the hood).

A BCM reset is performed by pulling the fuse and that removes battery power.....Right?.....Replacing the negative wire for the 12v battery does the same thing (except to the whole car).....Right?......

You already performed a BCM reset when you removed the negative wire from the 12v battery

JoeCVT = Just your average CVT owner

 

[talonmike]

On my car I had to replace the positive side of 12v battery also. It was corroded from inside.

 

[Hybrid-Battery-Repair]

Yes, I replaced two ground straps (driver's side of engine) and the negative wire for the 12v battery.

That was why the error went away for a while, not because of the grounding strap. It's low voltage on a stick-pair.

 

[mike75bug]

IMA Errors are back.

That was why the error went away for a while, not because of the grounding strap. It's low voltage on a stick-pair.

OK, I got it. Before it wasn't clear to me if the BCM was reset by simply removing the power wire or if I had to remove a fuse, charge up the battery, etc. that is listed in the Honda diagnostics manual I downloaded from here.

That cleared the error for about a week, but last week it happened again. Check engine and IMA light came on and my electric assist stopped working. Battery was showing a near full charge still.

I will need to find somewhere to check the code for me to see if it is the same code or not. Symptoms are the same at least.

Bummer, I am not enjoying this car much right now.

 

[mike75bug]

It's the IMA battery

The Honda dealer did the diags today and it is the IMA battery that is going bad, but not totally dead yet. I am going to post the car for sale now because I need a reliable daily driver and can't be without a vehicle while I try to fix the battery myself.

If anyone is interested in the vehicle let me know:

2000 Insight MT
- Silver
- 138,000
- Located in Central Maine

 

[Eli]

Ahh! No! Don't sell it! You will regret it when gas is $5/gallon this summer.........

There is no reason why you can't drive the car while you fix the IMA battery. You'll still get better fuel economy than just about any used car that you could pick up.

It is almost always cheaper to fix a car than it is to buy a new one. If you fix the IMA battery yourself, you will only be out a few hundred dollars and the time required to do it.

If you don't think you want to spend the time to do it yourself, just send it in for repair. You would be hard pressed to find a reliable used car for the $1000 it would cost you to have it repaired by a rebuilder.

Heck, send the battery to me and I'll do it for you for really cheap. I just can't stand the thought of someone giving up an Insight because the battery has died. That's a travesty!

 

[mike75bug]

Ahh! No! Don't sell it! You will regret it when gas is $5/gallon this summer.........

There is no reason why you can't drive the car while you fix the IMA battery. You'll still get better fuel economy than just about any used car that you could pick up.

I was thinking about getting another Honda Fit. We get about 42mpg with my wife's 2009 on the highway. Until the end of the month they have 0.9% financing.

I am a high school teacher and my wife is an emergency veterinarian. I am thinking we just need a more reliable car.

We are still thinking about this thought and I thank you for the input. The car is also going to need a new catalytic converter soon and a slight herky jerky (I have not yet done the valves and plugs yet).

 

[Eli]

You're thinking about a brand new car vs. just fixing the Insight?

Are you sure that's a good idea given the current economic conditions? No matter how you spin it, you will be paying $15,000 - 20,000 plus interest(albeit 0.9%).

You could replace every wear item in the Insight with brand new equipment direct from Honda for less than that. I know that we often get stuck on the idea of something, especially a 'rewarding' purchase, but try looking at it from that point of view.

The Insight is a very, very reliable car. It's also very cheap on maintenance. I admittedly don't know a lot about the Fit, but I would bet that it has a timing belt. Even if it's maintenance intervals are the same as the Insight's, each service will probably cost more.

If you sit down and think of ONLY the money, then it makes absolutely no sense financially to buy a brand new car. If you're really stuck on getting rid of the Insight, I suggest a certified used car. I will never buy a brand new car just because I can't stand the thought of it becoming used - and losing a significant chunk of it's value - the very moment I drive off the lot.

For less than $5000 you could have a brand new battery from Honda, a new catalytic converter, a new EGR valve and have them clean the EGR plate.

You would then likely get another 130,000 miles out of the car with only routine maintenance. But it shouldn't be necessary to spend anywhere near that much with services like Hybrid Battery Repair available. If you can do any of the work yourself, that is even more savings. And for me, I enjoy working on cars. That's the great thing about the Insight - None of it's major problems will leave you stranded by the side of the road. Herky jerky, synchro grinding, battery errors(disclaimer: I am aware that sometimes an IMA error causes the DC-DC converter to quit charging the 12V battery, but I do not know how common it is).

Of course, as an Insight owner, I am biased.. But if you look at this objectively, you will never come out ahead buying a new car. Humans are funny creatures; we want a reward. When you buy a brand new car, you are rewarded with a shiny new object. When we're forced to fix a car that we've had for a long time, you're only rewarded with a car that operates as it should - but the same old car. It's easy to get hung up on the emotional aspect of buying something new, but it rarely if ever makes sense financially.

In this case, it goes way beyond MPG alone. If I were in your shoes, I would have the Insight fixed - anything and everything it needs - and then put the money that you would be spending on a car payment into a savings account. As you watch your savings account grow, my bet is that you will see the Insight in a different light - as a blessing, not a burden.

But everyone is different.

 

[mike75bug]

I am working on figuring out how to run the car without the IMA battery. If I can do that for a few months while I pick away at rebuilding the battery pack myself it is worth keeping.

Up here in Maine we have something you don't have in NM, rust. I think the dielectric effect actually makes it worse with the aluminum body. I definitely would not put $5,000 plus into this car.

I have been driving with almost no assist for a while now. The car is exceedingly slow with lots of downshifting on hills. I felt almost no difference once my IMA light came on an assist completely turned off. I also am getting the same mpg (about 52mpg, highway driving around 75mph with lots of short hills).

 

[Eli]

I just noticed that the 2011 Fit is only rated at 33MPG highway for the MT model. Are you using hypermiling techniques to get 42MPG out of it? If so, would I be correct in assuming that your Insight MPG is stellar?

 

[mike75bug]

I just noticed that the 2011 Fit is only rated at 33MPG highway for the MT model. Are you using hypermiling techniques to get 42MPG out of it? If so, would I be correct in assuming that your Insight MPG is stellar?

No, I think the rating is off on the fit. The worst mileage we ever got was 34mpg.

The Insight is only getting 50-52mpg right now. It is running rough and I need to adjust valves, plugs, and check the EGR plate. I was waiting to see the status on the battery before doing any further work.