How to disable Assist/Regen

30177 Views 81 Replies 32 Participants Last post by charlieinjax, Dec 24, 2012

Calpod

Discussion Starter · Nov 22, 2005

Here is how to disable Assist/Regen when you don't need it, such as when you are trying so keep from depleting the battery charge on long hills, or when you don't want background charging, or when you are going downhill and don't want to regen.

Take the 2 wires from the clutch pedal, run them thru a toggle switch and you're done, now anytime you don't want to use assist or regen, just flip the switch and IMA is disabled. :idea:

41 - 60 of 82 Posts

TopFuelTim

· #41 · Oct 28, 2011

Thank you on the quick feedback

Hi Eli and Calpod,

Thanks for the quick replies.

Eli, I can't see my switch where I mounted it (in one of the three removable blanks to the left and below the steering wheel, right above the little door, so a lighted switch wouldn't help. It is very easy to reach, as I just put my hand toward the dash, and installed the switch where it felt natural. Also, I didn't know how much or how little voltage was involved, or if the extra load of a light would throw off the computer.

Calpod, I just took it for a test drive, and the green indicator light does not come on at all when I have the switch engaged. It does come on when the car thinks I should shift when the switch is not engaged. I wired it in parallel, and it works great. I was thinking I would like to put a little LED in one of the A/C vents, and run the wire down to the switch, but again, I don't want to screw up anything computer wise. Also, there may not be enough voltage, so it might need a 12v feed wire, and then maybe diodes.....

Shoot, I get lost in electronics extremely quickly. I can usually follow directions from people who have already blazed a trail before, and can manage a soldering pen decently, but consider myself a rank beginner in the electronics field, so I depend on you guys for help. Hopefully, I can give enough feedback later to "pay it forward".

Anyway, this was just a thought, as I have to reach down and touch the switch sometimes to remember which position I left it in. If I could see an indicator light up on the dash somewhere it would help. No biggie.

Thanks again,

Tim Glover

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Willie Williford

· #42 · Oct 28, 2011

If I can remember right, I think all the clutch switch does is ground a particular circuit. Probably installing the light in series with the switch would help. (Low wattage LED)
(Better recheck the wireing diagram.)
HTH
Willie

jerrydelrey

· #43 · Oct 28, 2011

I did this mod a while ago. I just wanna say Thanks cal pod for coming up with this mod.

TopFuelTim

· #44 · Oct 29, 2011 (Edited)

possible Calpod indicator LED diagram

Willie Williford said:
If I can remember right, I think all the clutch switch does is ground a particular circuit. Probably installing the light in series with the switch would help. (Low wattage LED)
(Better recheck the wireing diagram.)
HTH
Willie

I wondered if the clutch circuit had enough extra voltage to light an LED, but was afraid adding an LED in series with the switch would goof up the signal to the computer, so I tried the following, and want to ask for your input.

Let me start this by saying I am not an electrical engineer. I did want to ask if you think my diagram for adding an LED is somewhere in the ballpark of being correct. It is based on one side of the clutch switch being an actual ground, and the other being the computer connection.

I was looking at 5mm LEDs, maybe green. One of the vendors recommended a current limiting resistor and said to divide voltage by 0.02. I got a value of 600, and I think he means ohms. I also wanted the current to only flow one way, for fear of giving the computer a false signal. I think I should use diodes, but am not sure of the value.

Please let me know what you think.

Thanks,
Tim Glover

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E27006

· #45 · Oct 29, 2011 (Edited)

Leds

An easy solution is to buy a 12volt LED.

It is the usual led but manufactured with the correct value of resistor inside the device,to operate on 12 volts see this link

5V and 12V LED Types : Maplin

nasphere

· #46 · Oct 29, 2011

TopFuelTim said:
I was looking at 5mm LEDs, maybe green. One of the vendors recommended a current limiting resistor and said to divide voltage by 0.02. I got a value of 600, and I think he means ohms. I also wanted the current to only flow one way, for fear of giving the computer a false signal. I think I should use diodes, but am not sure of the value.

Diodes aren't needed as far as I know. LEDs are diodes so you don't need a diode in series with them.

The resistance required is pretty easy to figure out.

(switch voltage) - (LED voltage) = (resistor voltage)
5v-2.5v=2.5v (assuming 5v, not 12v because i really don't know)

Given I=V/R (current equals volts over ohms)

The value you stated was .02 (20mA). So just plugging those numbers into I=V/R is: (.02A)=(2.5v)/(125R). Now saying you really don't want to run the full 20mA, just choose a higher resistor value like the one you have

.

TopFuelTim

· #47 · Oct 29, 2011

Do you think this will work?

E27006 said:
An easy solution is to buy a 12volt LED.

It is the usual led but manufactured with the correct value of resistor inside the device,to operate on 12 volts see this link

5V and 12V LED Types : Maplin

I appreciate all the quick replies. I stopped by Radio Shack this afternoon, and asked the sales person there if they had a 12V LED and diode. This may be simple, but I wanted to ask here first before going in. The empty wrapper is for the pushbutton switch I am already using. With the clerk's help, I chose this diode (for the wire coming from the computer side of the clutch switch) and got just the LED after you all pointed out to me it was already a diode (I'm learning as I go).

Does this look like a workable solution to add an indicator?

Thanks,
Tim Glover

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nasphere

· #48 · Oct 29, 2011

Hmm. No, the zener diodes are for voltage clamping or voltage regulation. I really don't think you need any diodes if you're just looking to parallel a switch.

That LED is a good choice and should work fine

E27006

· #49 · Oct 30, 2011 (Edited)

Led

The led is marked 12V DC 15mA.

The resistor is built into the device, so no external resistor required

TopFuelTim

· #50 · Oct 30, 2011 (Edited)

nasphere said:
Hmm. No, the zener diodes are for voltage clamping or voltage regulation. I really don't think you need any diodes if you're just looking to parallel a switch.

That LED is a good choice and should work fine

From E27006: "The led is marked 12V DC 15mA.

The resistor is built into the device, so no external resistor required "

UPDATE: I tried putting the LED in parallel with the switch, got nothing. I then got out my multi meter (which is about crapped out) and measured about 4.5 volts DC after it warmed up outside (I originally got 0.003V earlier this morning when it was about 40 degrees F), so that would maybe make sense.

I measured voltage after the 12V LED, and got a reading of 10.45V. I do not want this going to the computer, so I need to regroup. I tried the diode just for giggles, but to my surprise, I got 9.95 V one way, and then 7.5V the other way. I guess that is the Zener voltage, but not sure how it would help (or hurt) here.

Tim Glover

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E27006

· #51 · Oct 30, 2011 (Edited)

Regroup advice

Redesign the circuit, buy a switch, double pole single throw (DPST) and make the green led function as a simple on/off indicator, use one side of the switch to turn the green led on or off, and use the other side of the switch to link across the clutch switch.

That way there will not be direct connection of the green diode to the ECM, so no problems with voltages going to the ECM.

InsightGary

· #52 · Oct 30, 2011

Be Careful

Tim,
As a EE, I think you should be a little careful here, you can blow your ECM with faulty connections!
That said, at least according to the shop manual, there IS a diode inside the ECM so that should prevent you from blowing it. What you need is to hook the + side of your LED to 12V and the - side to the switch. BUT, the LED might come on at the wrong time, not sure...
What you really should do is use a DPDT (double pole, double throw) switch and hook it up so the car wiring and your added LED wiring are separate. With the double throw switch you can set it up so the LED is on as you desire (ON=Assist on, or Calpod overide on (assist off)).

BTW, thanks again to Calpod for this mod. I put it in mine the first week I had my Insight and have saved alot of gas since!!

Gary

E27006

· #53 · Oct 30, 2011

Switch type DPDT or DPST

I agree with insightGary. I would suggest Double Pole Single throw, as they have (usually) only 4 tags to identify and not 6, so less likelyhood of confusion when constructing the mod

To start the installation forget the led for a moment, just wire the DPST switch to the clutch and get the Calpod mod working to your satisfaction, then get on with wiring the led indication circuit, by default the two unused conecctors on the DPST switch are for the diode, you will have to run a 12Volt feed to the anode of the LED. connect the cathode of the led to the spare pole of the DPST switch and then a ground wire from the remaining contact on your switch

TopFuelTim

· #54 · Oct 30, 2011 (Edited)

No magic smoke : )

E27006 said:
Redesign the circuit, buy a switch, double pole single throw (DPST) and make the green led function as a simple on/off indicator, use one side of the switch to turn the green led on or off, and use the other side of the switch to link across the clutch switch.

That way there will not be direct connection of the green diode to the ECM, so no problems with voltages going to the ECM.

UPDATE 3:

I just found the new posts, and will go with a double pole single throw switch. I like that idea much better. I tried it out on a short trip, and it seems ok, but I don't want to mess up the computer. In the meantime, I unplugged my new circuit and went back to just the Calpod switch.

Tim Glover

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nasphere

· #55 · Oct 31, 2011

TopFuelTim said:
Last edited by TopFuelTim; Today at 12:41 PM. Reason: can't spell

lmao

Sounds like everyone here is on track, DPST switch would work great

TopFuelTim

· #56 · Nov 6, 2011

Works like a charm

E27006 said:
Redesign the circuit, buy a switch, double pole single throw (DPST) and make the green led function as a simple on/off indicator, use one side of the switch to turn the green led on or off, and use the other side of the switch to link across the clutch switch.

That way there will not be direct connection of the green diode to the ECM, so no problems with voltages going to the ECM.

Thanks E27006, I followed the advice, got a DPST switch, and it works pretty as can be. The LED is on whenever the Calpod switch is activated. Only problem is if sunlight is shining on LED, it gets washed out, but that doesn't happen very much.

Tim Glover

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Mobiloman

· #57 · Jun 22, 2012

Getting ready for road trip in my 2001 MT insight, see: http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...734-has-anyone-driven-across-usa-insight.html

just tried the clutch switch disconnected, it would prevent engine start but would not prevent assist or regen!

My hybrid battery was replaced under warranty 8 months ago, must be the most recent honda firmware thats doing it, as discussed by members with '05-'06 models.

Does anyone here know a work around (short of MIMA), re-flash to the old firmware?

Also: everyone on here who uses the switch: have you really avoided Honda Warrantied service to allow you to use this mod?

Too Bad, I guess Ill have an empty battery at the top of every mountain pass.

5631

· #58 · Jun 22, 2012

Mobiloman said:
Too Bad, I guess Ill have an empty battery at the top of every mountain pass.

IMA prevents the battery pack from emptying completely. When the SOC drops low enough, further assist will be prevented and involuntary regen will occur to raise the SOC. Because your battery pack was replaced so recently, it should be in reasonably good condition, so why bother trying to manage its SOC? Just drive…

But if you want to use less assist and keep the SOC higher, simply downshift until assist drops to a level acceptable to you. The ICE is quite happy and powerful at higher engine speeds. But when you ascend a mountain pass, you will descend eventually. If you limit assist and keep the SOC higher than it would be otherwise, the SOC could become too high for further regen as you descend which means that you won't recapture some of the energy you used climbing the pass.

spets

· #59 · Jun 22, 2012

Mobiloman,

I have a feeling you wired it up wrong. you said the disconnected clutch switch would prevent engine start but would not prevent assist/regen. that is the expected behavior if the switch is disconnected. The engine will only crank over when the clutch switch is "on", as it is when you push the clutch pedal down.

You need to wire the switch in parallel, not in series. If you wire in in parallel (just insert the wires into the existing connector), you'll be able to start the car without pressing on the clutch (MAKE SURE IT IS OUT OF GEAR!), and assist and regen will be disabled. Assist and regen is disabled when the computer thinks the clutch is pushed in.

retepsnikrep

· #60 · Jun 22, 2012

Mobiloman said:
Does anyone here know a work around (short of MIMA), re-flash to the old firmware?

1) Sadly the Honda factory software flash tool does not allow software downgrades only upgrades.

2) The MCM and BCM are not field reprogrammable.
They are replaced not reprogrammed when batteries are changed.

3) Only the ECM on later ~2003+ Insights is flashable ASFAIK

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