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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I test drove an Insight today. I was curious so I tried it and I have to say I quite enjoyed it. It is comfortable and has very light steering. Perfect for pottering around town. I took it onto the highway for a bit. I never got the impression that I want to get out and push. It felt zippy from the word go. It is smaller inside, but I didn't feel cramped. It's a perfectly lovely car.

I was surprised to find features such as parking radar and auto door locking when you drive off, in this car. When the Insight is in ECON mode you do notice the aircon going off in AUTO STOP mode. This can be annoying when the weather is hot, but then I guess one can just switch to normal mode. Although my Prius' aircon can run without the engine running, it does eat up the battery quickly in hot weather in which case the engine has to come on anyway.

I really like the styling of the Insight. It's a very attractive little car. I'm just curious how long its' going to be around. I get the idea that Honda is looking at an early update to the model considering its' poor sales overseas. I think any comparison of the Insight to the Prius is unfair and the Insight is probably suffering because of it. Standing on its' own, the Insight is a car I would be very happy to own. No problem.

[that's the salesman in the photo]
 

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It is puzzling to me too why the I2 hasn't been more popular.

Where do you live? And what year Prius are you comparing it to?
 

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The only thing that bugs me is the bar in the rear window. Bad design.
All other things I can tolerate.

I do enjoy the economy, and when I'm driving it (wife's car) I find myself doing things to get the best score (highest number of trees at the end, when you shutdown the engine, was 4.5).
That means I'm driving like the a$$holes that I like to make fun of when I'm driving my BMW. :D:rockets:
 

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Yes, I have to agree that the Prius should not be compared to the Insight and
one point that comes to mind is that the Prius is classified a Mid-size car and
the Insight is a Compact car.
Car reviewers seemed to forget that point when they complained about the
interior room of the insight.
And I believe Honda really shot themselves in the foot by supplying LX models to
car reviewers when the Insight was first released thinking that Price was the most
important issue for new buyers. The 2010 LX models did not have Vehicle Stability
Control or Traction control so when car reviewers took the LX Insight out for a
test drive thay all came back shaking their heads and telling the world that the
Insight handled horribly.
I test drove both models and there really is no comparrision.
The 2010 LX model would not be your choice if your driving style is "spirited" or you have
long highway comutes in windy places.
I guess Honda realized their error because all 2011 Insights now come standard
with Vehicle Stability Control & Traction Control but the LX price is now higher.

Tnqr-Toy's Dad
 

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Welcome aboard. Wow, you got a demo model with wheel covers and fog lamps? Yeah, econ makes it a bit sluggish. I can get and maintain 90mph, its just the sudden movement from a dead stop and rather or not you got the IMA assist thats the question.

What if any short comings have you experienced from the prius? You got a gen 1 or gen 2 prius model?
 

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Good to hear from a Prius owner. One quick question though: The most annoying issue of I2, namely, recalibrations; which puts the engine under forced recharge mode even if you're going uphill, does the Prius suffer a similar problem when battery is drained at a time when you need power?
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Good to hear from a Prius owner. One quick question though: The most annoying issue of I2, namely, recalibrations; which puts the engine under forced recharge mode even if you're going uphill, does the Prius suffer a similar problem when battery is drained at a time when you need power?
In Cape Town where I work, I have to go up a long uphill against Table Mountain almost immediately after driving out of work. In summer, the air conditioners' motor can drain the battery to almost nothing before I get to the hill. So, when I want to go up the hill the battery is empty, ie no assist. The engine then revs to about 6000rpm+, and starts to recharge the battery and drive the car. So it gets kinda sluggish. Is this what you guys call a "recalibration"? I've never heard that term used before.

The Prius doesn't have a gearbox like the Insight to convert engine RPM to torque. Instead the Prius has two motor/generators. MG1 and MG2. When you get into the battery empty situation, but you still demand power the engine will rev high. The engine will then use the one motor as a generator to feed power to the second motor to increase the available torque. It's like an electric gearbox where the ratio of MG1 and MG2 input and output speeds determine the gear ratio.

To clarify, the air conditioner is driven by a motor from the HV battery. There is no connection to the engine.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
The only thing that bugs me is the bar in the rear window. Bad design.
All other things I can tolerate.

I do enjoy the economy, and when I'm driving it (wife's car) I find myself doing things to get the best score (highest number of trees at the end, when you shutdown the engine, was 4.5).
That means I'm driving like the a$$holes that I like to make fun of when I'm driving my BMW. :D:rockets:
WOW! I had a string of BMWs before I bought my Prius.

318i E30
535i E34
730i E32 Awesome car! 3Litre V8
318i E46
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Welcome aboard. Wow, you got a demo model with wheel covers and fog lamps? Yeah, econ makes it a bit sluggish. I can get and maintain 90mph, its just the sudden movement from a dead stop and rather or not you got the IMA assist thats the question.

What if any short comings have you experienced from the prius? You got a gen 1 or gen 2 prius model?
It's a GEN2. The GEN1 was never sold in SA. I can't think of any shortcomings, really. If I have to look for some I'd say rear visibility can be better, but I've learned to work around it. Engine can drone sometimes when you floor it, but again it comes with the territory.
 

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you're joking, right?

I like the bar too, it cuts the headlight shine of most trucks and SUV's inside the car. On a plus side I use the side mirrors on my I2 more than any other car I've ever driven because they are huge and that good.
 

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Thats part of it, the state of charge screen will show a nearly full battery, then suddenly its empty and the electrical side refuses to help and its all from the gas motor and it still insists on charging the battery too.

I drove a prius a few years ago. Unless I did not do it right the screen said I got 99mpg on my little test drive. I babied it til I got down a hill, I ended up flooring it and hearing the motor rev as it came out of it.

So, when I want to go up the hill the battery is empty, ie no assist. The engine then revs to about 6000rpm+, and starts to recharge the battery and drive the car. So it gets kinda sluggish. Is this what you guys call a "recalibration"? I've never heard that term used before.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
In the Prius the battery will try to stay at about half. If it gets very full from regen, the car will use the extra until it's half again. I live on a hill and to get to a shop at the top of the hill I have to pull out of my driveway and still drive up the hill. Often then the battery will drop to almost empty on my way up. This is when the engine will rev higher than usual and start to charge, but there's no sudden drops from full to empty. You always see it coming and only when you're really demanding like charging up a hill.

I think the behavior of suddenly dropping from full to empty and then charging without any assist would put me off from buying an Insight. I want warning if I'm not going to have enough assist I don't want it suddenly and unexpectedly thrown at me just as I need to overtake or something.

Have you ever been in a situation where you find yourself wanting to shout:"Common MOVE damnit!" to your Insight? As I said earlier on this thread in Summer my Prius can have an empty battery from the aircon drain and I still need to get up a steep hill near work. Then it gets very revvy and snail like.
 

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Have you ever been in a situation where you find yourself wanting to shout:"Common MOVE damnit!" to your Insight? As I said earlier on this thread in Summer my Prius can have an empty battery from the aircon drain and I still need to get up a steep hill near work. Then it gets very revvy and snail like.
The I2 behaves better when the battery is depleted. There was a couple of videos on Youtube, in Japanese, showing a 3 laps race at Tsukuba between an I2 and a Prius. I found the thread about it, but the videos have been removed from Youtube :mad:

http://www.insightcentral.net/forum...-gen-discussion/15649-eco-battle-tsukuba.html

In the video, you could see the Prius driver shouting to his car, excatly what you say: "Common MOVE damnit!", and the I2 passed it and just increased its lead after that. The I2 driver didn't shout anything to the car, just keep driving smooth. The transition between the time it has full assist, to the one where it recharge, but still requires high power to move, is much less than the Prius.
 

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Solution to a puzzle

It is puzzling to me too why the I2 hasn't been more popular.
In my opinion, Honda could have used some marketing expertise from the U.S., Canada or Western Europe, before the final design went on to be manufactured. Those of us in Western cultures do a lot of things by the numbers and face it, the estimated mileage numbers stink when you consider your normal mode. What was wrong with the I1 method where the "S" gear ratio (does this mean sport, or what?) is the special setting and normal got you 61 mpg. A lot of people pick out economy cars by looking at those EPA numbers. Had the Econ mode been deemed the normal setting, the I2 would be knocking on the Prius's door. It should have been considered.

My other gripe is any Hybrid vehicle should have Cruise Control standard. That seems ridiculously simple. How much does it really cost to put it on at the factory. If it was $75 actual cost to Honda I'd be surprised.

Just my two cents,
Brian
 

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That can be very fustrating. Basically when it happens it feels like you have the parking brake up a few clicks. The engine revs a thousand rpms higher than normal. I drive it like my 240d I had. I floor it, then start to release the petal as I come up to desired rate of acceleration or speed. I tell my dad if he ever drives it not be afraid to push the petal to the floor like the benz we had.

Ive never shouted at my car, but I have spent some time in teh left lane going 5mph, with traffic in the center lane going 70mph anf wished I could accelerate fast enough to merge over. I generally let a few car spaces develop in front of me, turn off econ and go to sport mode, then go when I see an opening.

I think the behavior of suddenly dropping from full to empty and then charging without any assist would put me off from buying an Insight. I want warning if I'm not going to have enough assist I don't want it suddenly and unexpectedly thrown at me just as I need to overtake or something.

Have you ever been in a situation where you find yourself wanting to shout:"Common MOVE damnit!" to your Insight?
 

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Have you ever been in a situation where you find yourself wanting to shout:"Common MOVE damnit!" to your Insight? As I said earlier on this thread in Summer my Prius can have an empty battery from the aircon drain and I still need to get up a steep hill near work. Then it gets very revvy and snail like.
No need to shout, just floor it and it will. This should be true for any car.

My I2 doesn't really recal as per Cobb's definition (yet?) because mine is still relatively new (only <5000 km). My gripe is that it continues assisting until a forced recharge becomes necessary. It could be the battery management didn't know the true state of charge and used the battery too much, or it could be a purposed discharge and recharge. It's annoying regardless because the drive-by-wire system doesn't completely mask the state of charge from you. Throttle response is very sensitive when battery is full, but reduced when it's drained. Braking response is the opposite, it can take some time to adopt to this behaviour.
 
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