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If the RLF flag is set (1) then 168V resting might still be too high for regen with a newer 2005 BCM.
 

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^ Agree with that. When I was experimenting with a 2005 BCM, the pos recal threshold seemed to be about 168V resting (16.8V tap)... I also recall that BCM does some seemingly weird things 'up there', maybe pos recals to ~81%, disables regen until you burn-off about 6%, can spontaneously jump back up to nominal 75% when you key off and then on, jumps down from I think 72% directly to 66%, etc. etc.
 

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Discussion Starter #24
Okay, noted.

I need to repair my OBDIIC&C, I think maybe a cap or two is bad or it needs a new processor or something?

It incorrectly registers SOME button clicks. This is the one from IF 2019 -- where it needed a new button -- I put a new one in but it still acts finnicky -- usually doesn't click in the right direction. Some screens are worse than others? It works well on the IMA SoC // Fan Speed screen, and on the main screen, but on the choose params screen or the settings screen it almost never clicks on the right thing. I did that software update from April on it too.

ODBIIC&C_V01N_2620_030120_US1.hex
 

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Discussion Starter #26
Okay Peter, @retepsnikrep I've got the car back this weekend. On the OBDIIC&C I was using I removed the capacitor, it works great now. This is what I see:

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Car was turned off here, but when it was on the Rlf was 0, and then I noticed while driving for a second there was a flag to the right of it, it was a 6 it wasn't an a or whatever, it was a 6.

Car is down to 144 resting volts now, and I got Alf to display where Fin is in the screenshot, and it was showing 0 as well when the car was on.

So I'm guessing I may not have made a tight enough connection on the BCM Interceptor when I jumped pins 1 and 2 and 4 together. Which is okay, beacause I'm going to take the batteries out and re-do some wiring in there anyway over the next day or two, and I'll put in a button to toggle the Regen flag manually.
 

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Discussion Starter #27
I have the car torn apart now. I used a multimeter on the BCM Interceptor J4. Pins 1 and 2 and 4 are all shorted together when I check the continuity with a multimeter, so I don't think I had them screwed together too weakly.

This BCM interceptor I have doesn't have only 1K resistors on it, it has a few of a different value. Do I need to switch them to all be 1K?


86279
 

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RLF and/or ALF = 0 on the OBDIIC&C means the flags are not set.
So they won't be affecting regen/assist.

I would change R1 R2 & R3 to 1k parts.

Are you using voltage detecting BCM Interceptor code?

Is it correctly set for 72 LTO cells?

What version of the OBDIIC&C code are you using?
 

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What are these resistances anyway. The 5 bands are confusing me. I thought 4 bands was the standard. Anyway her R1, R2 and R3 look like they might be 22 ohm(no mutiplier).

I have the same values but with two red bands at end. Is the change to 1K universal guidance? Also, what tolerance is acceptable?

Later:
Never mind on values, I found it on the internet. Still wondering if 1K guidance is universal upgrade advice?

These 5 ring codes get really confusing when the resistors are very small with tight spacing of bands. If the resistor is anything other than white, silver or gold tolerance, there isn't a clue which way to read the code :eek:
 

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Discussion Starter #30 (Edited)
RLF and/or ALF = 0 on the OBDIIC&C means the flags are not set.
So they won't be affecting regen/assist.

I would change R1 R2 & R3 to 1k parts.

Are you using voltage detecting BCM Interceptor code?

Is it correctly set for 72 LTO cells?

What version of the OBDIIC&C code are you using?
Hi Peter, I will change the resistors to 1k.

Code being used is the one posted here:

BUT I think that's incorrectly configured now because I switched the BCM Fooler resistors to be 20.5K ohm because I was able to buy some of those at 0.1% tolerance
  • Still no pre-resistor on the BCM fooler.
  • Same current hack resistors (1K MCM and 240 in the BCM)
OBDIIC&C startup reads:

OBDIIC&C 030120 V01N
9600b IMAC&C CONTROL
32MHZ 18F2620(US1)

I've ordered the newer 18F2680 processors, but they aren't here yet.
 

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That BCM Interceptor code (BCMI_L144_H180_T25_S75_280620) should work with your 72 cell pack.

Ther BCM Fooler resistor values don't matter if you aren't using a pre-resistor.

Still wondering if 1K guidance is universal upgrade advice?
It's not hyper critical and neither is tolerance.

If you have manual dashboard switches to activate the flags you are dragging the 5v low current signal upto the front of the car and then back again, so this makes it a bit more vulnerable to IMA noise. The lower value resistors just harden it slightly, but if false flag triggering is a problem you can also add 10k pull up resistors from +5v to Pins 1 & 2 on J3.

The BCM Interceptor design is quite old and could be improved but it does work fine 99% of the time.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
@retepsnikrep
Hey Peter, I changed the resistors to all be 1K Ohm.

Hooked up to the car, no CEL or anything, am getting only very limited occasional <1A regen when idling as RPM changes or whatever.

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OBDIIC&C reports 0 on those flags.

Is the SoC too high for the car to want to charge? The voltage certainly isn't too high now.
 

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Discussion Starter #33 (Edited)
I have temporarily removed BCM Interceptor and twisted the leads from the orange and white wires together, as though they hadn't been cut.

The car regens as expected now. OBDIIC&C works for setting SoC. The car initially put it at 12% and started charging itself at about 11A in idle. I set it to 40% and the charging stopped. It would Assist, Auto-Stop, and Regen both on coast and braking -- it exhibited entirely normal expected behaviour with BCM Interceptor removed.

OBDIIC&C reported 131 Amps of Assist in 2nd, which is the highest I've ever seen, and 75 Amps of Regen when braking in 2nd, which is also the highest I've ever seen. I believe the current hack value in OBDIIC&C is listed as V166. I'm wondering if that's wrong, OR if perhaps the 2005 simply is able to regen and assist with higher amperage than my 2000?

EDIT
I verified, it says V166 for Amps Hack Value. But I also saw 151 amps in assist. I know that can't be right because the 150A fuse I put on the junction board would have blown.
 

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Discussion Starter #34 (Edited)
I was re-doing some most of the wiring yesterday and I had a "DUH" moment.

Problem:
  • Need to hook grid charger harness to junction board and to cooling fans
  • Need to hook junction board to BCM Fooler
  • Need junction board to be easy to remove//disconnect from everything
Solution:
Simply install TWO grid charger harnesses!!

This is genius, and I'll explain why.

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These are Prolong-style grid charger harnesses using the 4-pin TE Connectivity sockets with the standard pinout:
1: IMA +
2: Fan +12V
3: Fan Ground
4: IMA -

The fan + and - (aqua and white for right side of this install, blue and black on the shorter connector on the left) pass through one harness and into the other. Because of reasons the fan wires in this are spliced together, but the splices are soldered, heat-shrinked, and under the tech-flex so I'm not super worried about it. These two lines never connect to anything on the junction board -- they're just passing through.

IMA + and - (red and black) go to their respective locations on the junction board .

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Please excuse the half-disassembled state, but check out the grid charger port. One simple connection from the shorter grid charger harness to the car. That port has the two IMA + and - go to BCM Fooler location, and then the fan + and - go to the fan wires, which you can see their connections at the top-centre of the photo.

The best part about this, is that if you screw up and you connect it backwards, like you connect the long grid charger harness that was meant to go to the actual grid charger, if you connect that to the jack installed on the IPU case, there are no problems! No issues! It will work 100% totally fine. It's idiot-proof.

(Unless you stuck a diode inside the harness, in which case the BCM would read 0 volts. But normally the 1N-4005 diode goes inside the grid charger itself.)



Here are some other photos taken today. I just thought the bolts looked really good. These batteries aren't moving an inch if the car is in a wreck.

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Above photo, this side faces the front of the vehicle.


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This side faces the back of the vehicle. This is really heavy, but I've determined the best way to install these is to bolt these two to the frame first, then load it into the car. Final LTO pack gets bolted to the empty slot next, and then the junction board can be installed.
 

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The current hack multiplication factor for the OBDIIC&C should be 144, not 166.

BCM Interceptor

You won't get or expect SOC related charge at idle with the BCM interceptor if the soc is at 75%, as the car (ECM) thinks it doesn't need it. It's just doing enough regen to trickle and cover the dc-dc load.

That's normal expected and desired behaviour.

One of the points of the BCM Interceptor was to allow you to use the full capacity of your lithium cells without having to keep resetting soc with the OBDIIC&C etc. It also avoids any charging other than regen during over run or decelerating/braking.

If you had IMAC&C P&P then you can manually charge at idle by commanding regen.

Your BCM Interceptor behaviour as described in your last post sounds normal with the current software to me.

However now more people are getting Lithium, and not all have IMAC&C P&P we might want to modify the BCM Interceptor software a bit to add extra functionality.

We could add some code so that it uses the actual battery voltage as a basic SOC indication and then sets the OEM SOC accordingly ;)

I'll chat about this on the BCM INterceptor thread
 

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there is a discrepancy which Natalya identified, i.e. the OBD2C&C Current Hack "Amps Hack Value " . The 30% hack was changed to 40% recently due to mathematical percent calculation, therefore the issue. I've included that post below. I'll have to change mine too. Like other magic that comes from the OBD2C&C I'm not sure if the readout is simply a change in readout or an actual change to the system causing the readout to change. :)
86309
 

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I keep confusing myself with the current calculation. ;)

But I did test it against a clamp on meter the other day and 144 gave the same amps on the meter as on the OBDIIC&C. So I have to go with that.
 

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Good Stuff Natalya! Now that you've done on or two conversions have you settled on a location and hook-up for the Fooler and the Interceptor? I ask because I like the Fooler hook-up you pictured.
 

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Discussion Starter #39
The current hack multiplication factor for the OBDIIC&C should be 144, not 166.
Okay, will change to 144.

BCM Interceptor

You won't get or expect SOC related charge at idle with the BCM interceptor if the soc is at 75%, as the car (ECM) thinks it doesn't need it. It's just doing enough regen to trickle and cover the dc-dc load.

That's normal expected and desired behaviour.
I think you may misunderstand the problem I am having. This car will not regenerate under any circumstance with BCM Interceptor installed
  • No regenerative braking
  • No deceleration regeneration
The battery therefore gets depleted. It was all the way down to 144 volts and it still refused to get any kind of regeneration.

This is a 2005 so perhaps it responds differently to the 75.1% SoC shown on OBDIIC&C?

I uploaded the very same code onto it again before I made the post a few above with the OBDIIC&C screen and I verified it still will not do any regen (braking, deceleration, or otherwise) when BCM Interceptor is installed.

I also removed BCM Interceptor and twisted the cut leads back together to verify the car COULD get regen from braking and decelerating in gear, and it does, so I know the issue is not with me having wired something incorrectly.

One of the points of the BCM Interceptor was to allow you to use the full capacity of your lithium cells without having to keep resetting soc with the OBDIIC&C etc. It also avoids any charging other than regen during over run or decelerating/braking.

If you had IMAC&C P&P then you can manually charge at idle by commanding regen.
Is IMAC&C required for BCM Interceptor?

Your BCM Interceptor behaviour as described in your last post sounds normal with the current software to me.
I may misunderstand the way it is supposed to behave. I thought most Insights at 75% SoC will still regen when braking and decelerating in gear. Am I mistaken?
 

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Discussion Starter #40
Good Stuff Natalya! Now that you've done on or two conversions have you settled on a location and hook-up for the Fooler and the Interceptor? I ask because I like the Fooler hook-up you pictured.
This is conversion #3 for me. This is the only one where I've tried to use a BCM Interceptor. Here's the current wiring:

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Exposed leads at top of photo are for BCM Interceptor. They are routed into some Techflex, which in this photo comes into the IPU compartment at the left side of the fan.

IMA + and - for BCM Fooler are in the Techflex that is going across the top of the BCM. I used a spare speaker wire harness that I had laying around for the connection to the BCM Fooler inside that plastic enclosure.

I'm definitely open to suggestions on a better connector I could use at the BCM fooler for the IMA + and - than the one seen here. On the back wall there's a connector hanging diagonally on the left, it's another random connector I had laying around, I've got the fan + and - going through that. I could also use a better connector there. (This one was meant for 3 wires.)

The Junction Board --> Fan and BCM Fooler socket can be seen on the IPU case wall near the top left. You'll notice that right there I widened the gap in the IPU case where the 12mm bolt goes so that the IMA wire harness could come through right beside it. You may also notice, that for this install, I did NOT cut the IPU case at the fans at all. The new welded frame design makes it so that area doesn't need to be cut away.

The MCM and BCM and the BCM Fooler enclosure are all held in position by velcro. With the batteries in place they can't really move.

The only real problem with the wiring left for this install is I don't know what to do with the BCM temperature leads. But they don't move around much. The long green one has a clip holding it down underneath the BCM Fooler enclosure, but the others are loose

BCM Interceptor is going to live in an enclosure behind the IPU case wall, where those leads are. This position means I won't have to remove the batteries to get at it. If I had longer leads and a better connector for the fans I might have been able to flip it over to the inside of the IPU compartment and mount it on the wall there, immediately to the right of the socket for the junction board.
 
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