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Discussion Starter #1
Many of you might know that the Insight service manual is available on CD, but since I didn't I thought I'd post it.

I bought mine on eBay for about $18 U.S. (with shipping) from the seller in this auction:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=22797&item=2413975049

It arrived quickly and it good condition. I've played around with it a little and it appears to have everything a regular service manual would, including wiring diagrams.
 

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Good to know that there are CD versions of them available, take up less room but aren't as easy to drag into the car with you. I am guessing the wiring diagrams cover what color wires are what, or would I have to find the Electrical Troubleshooting Guide for that?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
cd

I was just looking at the diagrams. They do tell you what wire is for what, and you can print them out (as with the rest of the manual). I'm pretty happy with it so far.
 

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So, does the CD provide any information missing from the printed manual? Does it have any features beyond being a .pdf of the printed manual? Given the printed manual's size, it seems like they could post it on a Web site. It's not that big.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
CD

I don't know if it has more or different information as I have never seen a printed manual, but I wondered the same thing myself.
 

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I have ordered one myself. I'll give you guys a summary of it as well when I have it.
 

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I received the CD-Rom today. It is great. Everything you could ever want to know about the Insight. If anyone wants to know anything I am happy to cut & paste the relevant texts & diagrams into Word and e-mail it to you.
 

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Gee. Maybe someone should post a general source for this CD so that the rest of us could get one. If there's a link to an online source for ordering it, maybe that could go onto one of the Knowledge Base pages so people can get them long after this thread fades into the archives.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
CD

Will--You need to read my initial post. I already posted the only source I know. You can click on the link in the first post in the thread and it will take you to an expired auction for the CD. Then you just click on "View Seller's Other Items." He is auctioning them right now. I don't know how many he has or where else you could get it.

IHonda2002--All I know is it runs on Windows XP. There is no information given with the CD as to the systems it will run on, but I'd bet it will run on other fairly recent Windows versions. You could email the seller in the auction and ask him.
 

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Also runs on Windows ME. If you are technically minded, I recommend getting one.
 

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Insight Service Manual

Hey all,
I got myself one as well. The guy on eBay is in the UK, so its a UK version of the 2000 ESM. Its got some pretty sweet content.
The only thing that upsets me is that what I got was obviously a cheap CD-R copy of the ESM. So...if anyone is interested in a copy, contact me via PM or off-list for details (jim "at" advertising.com).
 

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I know I'm no fun for pointing out how illegal it is to violate copyright and either buy the illegal copies on Ebay or get illegal copies from someone who bought an illegal copy from Ebay, but... I wrote a book on guitars back in 1982 and collected honest royalties for it. I'd rather do without the CD than violate somebody else's copyright, just to get something cool and spiffy, even though I can probably take good care of the car without it.
 

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Insight ESM

Will,
I totally understand your point of view. I'm really not looking to make a profit on this, nor is it my intention to deny anyone of any royalties that may be due. As far as I know, this CD is not available for consumer purchase via Honda.
If someone has a LEGITIMATE source for this CD, please post it and I will happily withdraw my offer. I'm not looking to upset anyone, simply to contribute to the Insight community that has already helped me so much. Thanks!
 

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Discussion Starter #15
hmm...

I hadn't looked too closely, but mine is a copy, too. And it even says "Please do not copy" on it.

If this is Honda's work product (as opposed to a third party), I don't feel too bad for them. I think car manufacturers should provide a service manual with the cars they sell.
 

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Does this manual provide information on the proper oil flow rate or pressure. Thanks, Rick
 

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Insight ESM

Here's what I found in the ESM:
Oil pump Oil pressure with oil temperature at 80°C (176°F) At idle 70 kPa (0.7 kgf/cm2, 10 psi)
Oil pump Oil pressure with oil temperature at 80°C (176°F) At 3,000 rpm(min-1) 340 kPa (3.5 kgf/cm2, 50 psi)

Is this what you are looking for?
 

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Oil Pressure

Jim,
Thanks for the spec's. This weekend I hooked up oil pressure and temperature guages and wanted to know if my hook-up was causing any problems. I will have to check the values when at the specifications you provided but it looks very close. I am not a car mechanic or even close but the guage readings bring to mind a few questions.

1. The higher the RPM the greater the oil pressure (Is the oil pump driven by engine RPM?).

2. The lower the gear the higher the oil pressure (Even at the same RPM 1st gear has a much greater oil pressure reading that 5th). I see pressures of 70+ PSI in 1st gear at low parking lot speeds but only 58 PSI in 5th at 60mph. The max temp I have seen so far is 178F which it seams to maintain even when the outside temp drops.

3. Oil pressure is higher for colder oil. (Makes sense)

4. The oil pressure does drop to zero during autostop. I have always heard that starting a car caused the most engine wear because of the oil not circulating. The guage I am using has a 1sec update rate and the pressure probably takes 3-4 secs to build to normal (At least 5-8 psi in 1st sec). So will autostop cause more wear on the Engine?

Have fun, RIck
 

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1. I've never known a car that didn't use a mechanical oil pump driven by the engine. Simply put, if the engine is running, it needs oil, so it makes sense to make the engine pump the oil. An electric pump would require all the same parts, plus the electric motor, making a more complex system with more parts to fail. You don't want the oil pump to fail.

2. Interesting effect. I could guess, but I'd probably be wrong.

3. Colder is thicker for higher pressure. Yes.

4. While the engine runs, the oil pump takes oil from the oil pan at the bottom of the engine and sprays it into the interior top of the engine. Gravity takes it back down through a series of drain ports in the engine. Viscosity makes the oil stick to metal on the way down and gives it that protective lubrication. The oil also carries some heat with it that is slowly radiated from the aluminum oil pan, though the coolant system handles most of the heat management in the engine.

If oil circulation stops for a few seconds while the engine stops, viscosity holds most of the oil in place, since there's no motion wiping the oil away. There shouldn't be too much wear. Starting a cold engine is worse because the car has sat for hours, days or weeks, giving the oil time to slowly drip down, leaving the metal more thinly coated with oil. It takes a long time for the metal to become totally dry. That's why your owner's manual gives you special instructions for long term storage of the unused car.

Meanwhile, a cold engine is not just closer to being dry. It is also cold. Serious wear happens when you have heat AND lack of lubrication. That's when you ruin an engine. If you don't change your oil and filter and the filter clogs up and the bypass valve fails or the bypass valve passes crud thick enough to clog the drain ports that drip oil from the engine top to bottom, or if oil level gets too low for the oil pump to get enough from the oil pan, or if the oil pump fails... You can pretty much throw the engine away under these conditions. Rings weld themselves to cyllinder walls. Bearings grind away, leaving parts vibrating in a joint that needs to be tight. The vibration loosens bolts. Parts get loose enough to hit other parts. I witnessed a post mortem on a portable generator's engine that died this way. It's not pretty.

In that case, oil starved bearings on the crankshaft wore away, causing the connecting rod to vibrate where it joined the crank shaft. The bolts holding the clamp on the connecting rod came loose. Slop in the connecting rod allowed the end of the connecting rod to hit the cam shaft, snapping it in two. Half of the cam shaft kept moving. The other half stopped. A valve stopped in the open position. It's piston hit the valve and the engine immediately stopped, never to run again. The generator that had pumped water and backed up solar electric power for my house suddenly became an Appalachian lawn sculpture.

And no, it wasn't my fault. While I was away on vacation, kids living in other houses serviced by the water pump ran the generator without checking the oil level. We carried water for about three months before the anticipated installation of underground power lines from The Grid to the other houses serviced by the pump. They didn't want to stick with solar power and we didn't want to pay for another generator we would not ultimately need.

Running water through indoor plumbing is a good thing. You don't fully appreciate this as much as I do.
 

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Will,
Thanks for the thorough explaination on autostop. I had thought about the parts still being lubricated but still didn't like the slow pressure rise. I had not considered that while the engine is stoped the parts arn't moving so the oil isn't being shaken off. The guage updates every second and the pressure will go something like 7,15,30,50,70 for driving in 1st gear.
In regards to the gear effecting pressure the only thing I could think of is that the highest RPM ratings can only be reached in the lower gears so having a higher pressure (flow rate) in 3rd might be a good idea. I'll have to get some averaged values for each gear at specific RPM values. I'll post the findings. Have fun, Rick
 
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