new owner... (used) 2001 auto. Ques about "auto stop&qu

2353 Views 11 Replies 6 Participants Last post by fleming95, Jun 11, 2008

dberns

Discussion Starter · Aug 28, 2005

Just picked up a used 2001 Insight with CVT. A bit worn but otherwise beautiful with great handling and mileage. I'm still getting used to it, But...

I'm not seeing the auto-shutdown kick in. I've turned off the a/c, made sure I'm in "D" (as opposed to "S") mode, but everytime I've come to a stop the RPM meter continues to show activity and the indicator light never comes on.

Any other things I should be checking out? Thanks

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Resist

· #2 · Aug 28, 2005

Is the engine warmed up when you do this? Have you read the owners manual?

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Insightful Trekker

· #3 · Aug 28, 2005

Re: new owner... (used) 2001 auto. Ques about "auto sto

Hi dberns and welcome to the forum :!:

If you don't have the owner's manual anymore (it often gets lost with a used purchase) the IC encyclopedia and knowledge base can help.

http://www.insightcentral.net/KB/index.html

http://www.insightcentral.net/encyclopedia/index.html

It may be that the brake switch has failed. Check your brake lights.

Please let us know how it works out

HTH!

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dberns

Discussion Starter · #4 · Aug 29, 2005

that "auto-stop" problem. thanks for the replies,

(apologies if this gets misformatted or quoting is off. I'm still learning this particular sytem).

First, thanks for the suggestions. I do have the owner's manual (hence my knowledge of being in "d" rather than "s" and shutting off the a/c completely to test things).

The engine stays on (at least per the tachometer and the lack of "auto stop" light) no matter what I've tried. This occurs both at the beginning of a run and once the engine has heated up...

I checked the brake switch - at least by looking at the brake lights, and they come on when the lever's pressed.

Any other suggestions? Thanks

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jbrasure

· #5 · Aug 30, 2005

Here are some other things to check. These are largely guesses, and I'm no expert on the Insight, so keep that in mind while reading my response.

1) Does your IMA battery guage show a low charge? If the charge is low, then I think autostop might be disabled??? Anybody know for sure?

2) How is the charge on your 12 volt battery? I had a bad 12 volt battery several years ago, and it caused the IMA system to get confused. Autostop worked ok, but I had other problems (like not getting any assist from the IMA battery.)

3) I also think autostop is disabled if your vacuum pressure is low. I believe it does this so that you have plenty of braking power even if you've been sitting still for a long time with the engine off. Maybe there is a faulty vacuum pressure sensor?

Once again, these are total guesses. Hopefully the other members on this forum will know whether these scenarios are possible.

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joecvt

· #6 · Aug 30, 2005

Besides the ones mentioned above (all good) I can only think of one
more...There is an outside temperature sensor attached to the inside
of the front bumper (look directly behind where a front license plate
would go - in the middle - looking from the radiator side). You should
see two wires connected to a black sensor...If the sensor is not
connected (or working) then auto stop will not occur.

JoeCVT - Just your average CVT owner

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dberns

Discussion Starter · #7 · Aug 30, 2005

replying re: no "auto stop"

Both the NiMH and the 12V battery seem fine (at least based on the displays and on the handling...). Vacuum feels good as well.

Would a defective outside temperature sensor show up in
a computer scan-read?

Oh, have I said that even with this glitch I love, love, love, my Insight...

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Insightful Trekker

· #8 · Aug 30, 2005

Re: replying re: no "auto stop"

dberns said:
<snip>

Vacuum feels good as well.

Would a defective outside temperature sensor show up in
a computer scan-read?

<snip>

No.

The climate control system can "override" auto stop when full auto mode is selected. Apparently there is a logic error in that when the climate control detects an internal error (open outside air temp sensor) it disables auto stop.

There is a vacuum switch that will disable auto stop when the brake booster pressure gets too high (braking effort would become abnormally heavy) and will also disable an auto stop.

Keep looking your getting warmer.

HTH!

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dberns

Discussion Starter · #9 · Sep 3, 2005

outside temperature sensor, was no auto-stop

I've taken a look behind the bumper and found the temperature sensor. All the wires were in place, but I unplugged and replugged on general principle. No change... still not getting auto-stop.

I figured I _better_ ask before trying this... can I simply short out (bypass) the sensor and "fool" the system (for test purposes only... If this got me back my auto-stop I'd get a new sensor forthwith).

Thanks

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Insightful Trekker

· #10 · Sep 3, 2005

"Shorting out" anything other than a switch (which is simply what it does) is usually a bad idea.

The thermosensor varies resistance by temperature and in some circuits of this type a 0 resistance (short) would cause permanent damage. The "normal" failure seen is of the opposite load, infinite resistance. If you know how to use a DVOM you can check that branch of the circuit without the possibility of damage.

Unfortunately we've covered the high points. And something *appears* to be malfunctioning. Just what and or where is now a process of elimination. You'll really need an Insight ETM (Electrical Troubleshooting Manual) and some better than average troubleshooting skills.

HTH!

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dberns

Discussion Starter · #11 · Jun 11, 2008

solved, was: 2001 auto. Ques about "auto stop&qu

way back I described how my 2001 (then new to me) used Insight was grrrrrate, but the auto-idle stop wouldn't work.

I sent off a note to Honda Central (as part of my recent plea to them begging that they reopen the production line) describing my frustration.

They just had one of their super duper techs teleconference with a local shop (Capital Honda, Lansing Michigan [a]). It took just about all day but... they found the problem.

Seems there's a small vacuum hose leading from the brake system to the sensor. It was crimped, so the system never realized that the brake was in use...

Hooray, Honda!

[a] a pretty good and honest bunch of people. It's a company store, so full price, but worth the trip.

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fleming95

· #12 · Jun 11, 2008

Re: replying re: no "auto stop"

Insightful Trekker said:
dberns said:

<snip>

Vacuum feels good as well.

Would a defective outside temperature sensor show up in
a computer scan-read?

<snip>

Click to expand...

No.

<snip>

HTH!

True, it seems from the manual that an OBD-II scan won't access the climate control subsystem.

However, internal climate control data is at your fingertips. The SM gives instructions on how to do two things: show error codes on the LCD on the climate control, as well as a second mode that displays the values of the ~8 sensor inputs that feed the climate control.

I don't immediately remember the way to readback the error codes. For the sensor inputs, before you turn the ignition key to position II, hold down the 'Auto' and the 'Mode' buttons (the upper lefthand square, and lower right round, buttons), then release.

LH round button, rear window defogger toggles through the sensors. Sensor # is displayed, then its current value. Readouts are in degrees C, or percent:

Sensor #1 is in-car temperature.
Sensor #2 is outside air temperature.
Sensor #3 is solar radiation sensor.
Sensor #4 is engine coolant temp <edit> - note that this number doesn't seem to update continuously, nor when the engine is restarted - I only saw 33 after the 15 mile run home today, and only have seen it as high as 65.
Sensor #5 is evaporator outlet temp.
Sensor #6 is air mix opening value, low ducts cool air, high ducts hot air
Sensor #7 is vent temperature out
Sensor #8 is 'TAO-fan'
Sensor #9 is vehicle speed.

-Jeff

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