Oil change interval

Speaking of filters, I recently replaced my cabin air filter for the first time and noticed a considerable quality difference between the japanese filter and the german made one that replaces it. At the Honda dealership I was told that it was the same filter as used in the CRV and that was the only reason they had it in stock.

Upon taking the factory one out and comparing it to the replacement upon close inspection it became evident that the origonal one was made for the Insight and the replacment conveniently just fit. The factory one had reinforcements and the pleats would go right in the seal on the plastic surrounding by just setting it in there. The CRV one you have to kind of make the first whole pleat go in to the seal around the edge. And it did not have the reinforcments.

It's not that it doesn't work, it just takes a little extra effort to ensure a proper seal on it. Something I could see a mechanic at a dealership overlooking.

My thought is that Honda would provide at the very least decent quality filters considering I'm using their oil and filters to appease them in the case of a warranty claim.

Since 3,500 and 7,500 sound like extremes, like one is for consistent, good conditions and the other is for consistent bad conditions, and my driving is always a mix, I went for 5,000 miles in my 1992 Civic. 210,000 miles later the only engine failure I've had was when the bearing in the distributor went bad, and even then the loud noise prompted replacement so I wasn't stranded on the highway. Tough little car.

I was changing oil ever 7,500 miles on the Insight and it was fine at 45,000 miles when it was destroyed by a Toyota Pathfinder and the Jaws of Life. Nobody was physically hurt, though the only person happy about the incident was the jock with the Jaws of Life.

When my new Insight shows up, I intend to go to 5,000 mile oil changes. It would be nice to see 200,000-300,000 miles from the Insight.

don't change too much!

Every time this topic comes up, I'm amazed how many of us follow the old american myth of "better too much than too little".

There is no reason whatsoever to change oil more frequently than the manufacturers recommendation. While it can't hurt your engine, it surely will hurt the environment by using more fossile resources and producing more toxic waste. You would think that Insight drivers would be more aware of that.

Note that Honda specifies 15000 km (9300 mile) intervals for the exact same car in Germany. Also note who is telling you to change it more often: the oil manufacturers and retailers and service stations, their interest is obvious. But even the car manufacturers are more liekly to err on that side: they need to support their dealerships who make most of their money in service.

Only in countries where this excessive waste of oil is not genreally accepted by the drivers (i.e. most of Europe) do manufacturers really research what change intervals are required. Most cars there are recommending 15000 to 25000 km (9300 to 15600 miles). And I'm sure they still don't want to get excessive warranty claims, either!

I'm sure this won't end the debate on oil change intervals but on point to Armin's posting is this:

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascit ... 604491.htm

I have seen that manufacturers are under political pressure to decrease the waste stream due to vehicle maintenance. However, cars are inhearantly "dirty", very energy intensive to produce and maintain. Will we as Insight driver's _ever_ save the gasoline energy equivalent of the cost of the aluminum used in our Insight? If so I believe it will take many tens of thousands of miles.

The lowest cost in both dollars and to the environment is to produce an efficent auto and maintain it nearly forever. Simply recycling its maintenance waste products.

In the real world I have seen _many_ cases of 300,000+ miles on many different makes and models. The primary difference in these few cars vs. the rest is frequent maintenance. And the primary life extending maintenance for the engine is frequent oil change intervals. I have _never_ seen a 300,000+ auto that had been maintained by the minimum manufacturers maintenance interval. With the increased precision and quality of materials the benefits of frequent maintenance dosen't begin to show up til the upper 100,000 mile range. The benefits of changing the other fluids and lubrication have similarly long return on investment times.

The big kink in this "arguement" is "refined" vs. "100% synthetic" oils. The synthetics can _probably_ take the punishment of extremely long change intervals. But for my money I'll still err on the lower cost side (more frequency) and take my waste oil to be recycled.

John K. Bullock
aka. Insightful Trekker

Insightful Trekker said:

...Will we as Insight driver's _ever_ save the gasoline energy equivalent of the cost of the aluminum used in our Insight? If so I believe it will take many tens of thousands of miles.

The lowest cost in both dollars and to the environment is to produce an efficent auto and maintain it nearly forever. Simply recycling its maintenance waste products.

Click to expand...

Good questions. One reason we got Insights is to tread lightly on the planet. Meanwhile, carried to an extreme, we should all just kill ourselves so we won't waste all this food we eat and air we breathe. It would really cut down on our consumption of resources and our contribution to landfills.

I, for one, don't see the world in black and white. I don't even just see greys. I see colors.

I look for improved means of living and reducing the impact of that life I'm priviledged to have. The Insight is better than most cars.

Aluminum production consumes a lot of energy, mostly in the form of electricity. Meanwhile, smelting the metals in a steel car frame burns up quite a bit of fuel as well. I'm not sure the energy difference is that great and I'm not sure where I'd find out an accurate measure for comparison. Given the overall lower weight of the Insight, I suspect that this lower mass consumes less power to make, including the chosen metal production, than an SUV that weighs three times as much, but I'm only guessing.

As for recycling oil, in Virginia, it is illegal to dispose of it any other way. Most mechanics and gas stations will take used oil and toss it into their used oil to be recycled, so it is easy to recycle oil, even if you change your own.

I tend to let Honda do it, since I've always gotten good service at the local dealer. They aren't cheap, but they've taken good care of both of my Hondas. I doubt the Civic would have made it over 200,000 miles without their thorough maintenance. If I did my own maintenance, something would have fallen off by now.