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Discussion Starter #1
RE:Honda Service Bulletin 07-036

Well,I took my 2002 in for the update...My dealers computer was not functional,so it could not be done.This was rather inconvenient,as I had to make special arrangements to get the car there @6am,then beg a 30 mile ride to work,only to have them call and say "We can't do it,our Honda computer has to be sent in.We will call ya"

My question is:

Does this reprogramming actually change anything at all?Or does it simply widen the parameters that would cause the CEL to glow?
I have had intermittent CEL's ,that extinguish themselves with time.
It sounds like this will not change the way the car runs,but will simply keep the light from coming on until things get a bit worse with the catcon.

Is this correct?Is this reprogamming simply to avoid codes?I am not subject to any testing for emissions(northern Wisconsin)...so I am thinking of just skipping this,as it takes up a day of my time just to get it to a dealer...

Is there any good reason to have this done,if you are never tested?
Will it change anything performance wise,other than fewer CEL displays?
Thanks very Much,Bob
 

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Hey, Bob. I was thinking along the same lines as yourself. I have an Insight that is exceeding my expectations in performance and I feel,
why mess with it? I am very leary of going to a Honda dealer who sees very few Insights with this after reading some of the other posts on owners knowing more than service reps. I did post on this site for feedback from those who have had this work done, and only received one reply, which was positive.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Please advise

Can someone briefly answer my question so I don't have to waste another day on this..PLEASE...

Is there any reason to believe my car will perform differently after the computer is flashed?

The obvious answer seems to be"NO"....

So if I am not subject to emissions testing,is there ANY reason to take the car in for this?

Thanks in advance for your time in responding...It may save me alot of hassle trying to get my car in to a dealer 100 miles away...
 

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if you dont mind driving with a check engine light on all the time, or you dont mind reseting the light with a scanner all the time, there shouldnt be anything wrong with leaving it alone. however... how will you know if you get another code if you just leave the CEL on? maybe something more serious...

mine is going in tuesday for the fix, along with the headlight switch and hand brake recalls.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
good point

yeah I shoulda thought of that ...light goes on randomly...probably should get the FIX.....

Thanks very much,Bob
 

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i was told that the car would fail the emissions test if it had not been updated. not sure if that is fact or not.

my local Honda place would not do it for me convenient to my work schedule so when my husband was working at Acura, he did it for me using the Honda computer.
 

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I know this is an old old thread, but hopefully someone in the community can answer my fairly general question: Does Honda fix this for free? I know recalls are no cost to the owner, and TSBs are also if under warranty. But I'm under the impression that since I'm out of warranty in both years and mileage at 219K on my 2002 I'll be footing the bill. The labor is quoted at .3 hours. I doubt a dealer is going to charge less than an hour though. So that's a hundred bucks just for a software update. Anyone have experience with this?
 

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recalls/ TSBs relating to emissions are free. I never did the update-honda pestered me for years (with notices in the mail) to have it done. Yes, my cel might come on sooner (that's subjective though), but i feel the car is fine as is, passes smog tests every time, and still gets great mpg (im also a conspiracy type person, and i don't want my mpg parameters to be changed from the re flash)
 

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Have you tried contacting the dealer and asking if recall repairs are free?
From what I understand this is not a recall, but just a Technical Service Bulletin (TSB), and that TSBs are only done free if you're still under warranty. I just wanted to know what others have experienced as far as dealers covering it or not before I contacted the dealer so I'd know what to argue for. I did not know that TSBs that are emissions related are supposed to be done for free biododge1. That's a nice piece of information.

I'll call the dealer today and see if they have the software. I've got the P0420 and P1420 codes. I'm thinking it might be best to clear those codes before I go in so that if they're not honest, they don't have the opportunity to tell me that my cat is bad and that's the only way to be rid of the codes for good.
 

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The dealer CAN run the Vin number to see if the recall has been done. Plus there should be a Vin "punch" mark if done....... Read the complete SR that I referenced to.

Willie
 

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I've already checked for the punch, and it's not there. I checked on both the inside of the engine compartment on the fender, and on the hood just in case they didn't understand the instructions. Both devoid of any dent.
 

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From what I understand this is not a recall, but just a Technical Service Bulletin (TSB), and that TSBs are only done free if you're still under warranty. I just wanted to know what others have experienced as far as dealers covering it or not before I contacted the dealer so I'd know what to argue for. I did not know that TSBs that are emissions related are supposed to be done for free biododge1. That's a nice piece of information.

I'll call the dealer today and see if they have the software. I've got the P0420 and P1420 codes. I'm thinking it might be best to clear those codes before I go in so that if they're not honest, they don't have the opportunity to tell me that my cat is bad and that's the only way to be rid of the codes for good.
You do want to leave the codes showing. The dealer needs the P0420 code displayed on the reader in order to do the TSB.

My 0.02 worth,
Tim
 

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That's good to know. I thought every car was eligible to have the software updated. I was just thinking that if they saw the codes, they could say something along the lines of, "Well, we'll do the software install, but we think that your cat is bad. So you need to do that too." Possibly even not changing the software. I just don't trust mechanics.

Years ago I took a subaru to an independent garage to have them clear codes that I had caused by forgetting to reattach a line on the intake system while changing plugs. (I didn't know that simply pulling the battery would do it.) They said they'd stick it on the computer to check the codes and clear them, then returned saying that I needed a new cat, which would be $1,200. Fortunately I was very skeptical since I knew why the light was on, and just had them reset the codes. Three weeks later I passed emissions well within spec, and the CEL never came back. I put another 52k on that 'bad cat' and probably another two emissions tests before selling the car.
 

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Going to Try a Quick Fix

I just picked up an '00 with 181K miles and the CEL came on within 2 days (sounds like i got scammed oh well.)

I've tried this before on my 96 accord and 02 civic. "Spark Plug de-fouler. "

It extends the secondary o2 sensor a bit farther out of the exhaust stream and helps keep the CEL off for erroneous Catalytic converter below threshold Codes like p0420. Sounds like what the TSB would do anyway but instead they manipulate the ECU.

(In actuality this is probably somewhat non-conventional, and possibly against your local Smog Laws, so do your own research before attempting.)

But I'm not buying an ECU and having it reprogrammed. My fix is less than $50.

I will keep you all posted after I've had it completed. I will also change my primary o2 sensor since I have the p1165 code on for it too, and MPG is important! I do not feel that my Cat is clogged or anything so I think I'll be good.
 

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2nd o2 sensor on an 2000?

If you extend the 2nd o2 sensor, you will have engine jerk because it will alter the mixture.
I may misunderstand this, but I thought the '00 only had one o2 sensor (on the first cat). I'm running my '00 with only the first cat. Anyone see a mechanical problem with that? I do understand what the 2nd does but there was a $ shortage...
 

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Since I'm running the early 315 ECU, I was getting the occasional P0420 code. I put in a non-fouler and haven't had a code since. And, I noticed no difference at all in lean burn engagement and haven't noticed any jerkiness either. I think the cost for the non-foulers (they came 2 to a package) was $6.
 

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with the de fouler installed i've driven 100 miles no problems and no cel. lean burn is there still. 8 dollar fix. and yes i have a 2000 with one set of o2 sensors. i believe when you manipulate the secondary o2 in this setup it is just a catalytic converter monitor and not a fuel ratio monitor used for correction. that is why it is fine without problems.

i'll keep you posted for long term results.
 
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