Honda Insight Forum banner

1 - 20 of 25 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
108 Posts
Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I have not seen this one posted yet so hopefully this becomes help for others as well.

I bought my first G1 this month. 2001 Blue 5speed with 114K on the OD. A few things that I have had to do to get it up to snuff and one of that last ones was the drivers door window rolls down but not always up. Taking apart the assembly everything is solid and nothing is broken. This drove me to think about the motor armature and contacts which might have build up and/or oxidation over time. Pulling it apart wow the surface looked nasty. So here is what I did and so far looks to have fixed my problems for less than an hour of work ans a small piece of sandpaper.

1) Removed door panel, window, and regulator assembly per Honda procedure. See following posting for service manual download if you don't already have it. http://www.insightcentral.net/forums/honda-insight-forum-1st-gen-discussion/16983-download-2000-2006-insight-service-manual-pdf-others.html

2) Remove screws that hold the motor housing in place on the actuator assembly. Screw might take a bit of force to get out. I used my cordless Makita Impact driver with the right size bit to get them loose easily. (Image “1.jpg”).
1.JPG

3) Rotate armature counter-counter clockwise or clock-wise (different depending upon age of the motor assembly photos) to be able to remove from housing (just like removing a bolt from a nut). End of armature is a worm drive that actuates the assembly this is why you need to rotate to remove. (Image “2.jpg”).
2.JPG

4) Clean armature surface that come in contact with housing contacts. I used 600 grit.

5) Clean both contacts on housing (Image “3.jpg”). I used 600 grit.
3.jpg
6) Wipe everything clean and reassembly. Good to go.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
108 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Thanks. Hope it helps a few as this site has been a great resource and made having my first G1 a pleasure to own and understand. Once I finish paying this one off then I'm going to find a fixer upper as they are way too fun to own and I feel very easy to work on.
 

·
Moderator
Joined
·
7,188 Posts
Excellent post! Will definitely have to keep this in mind if I ever have any troubles with mine.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
246 Posts
is mine different than yours? it looks different and im lost as far as how you got from pic one to pic two. could you provide some pics between #1 & #2 unless my motor is indeed different from yours? thanks

Sent from my SGH-T989 using AutoGuide.Com Free App
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
246 Posts
yes i believe we have the same part but your step #3 isn't working for me. this "armature" rotates as it is it's function but not to unscrew or release itself.

... okay i'm winding and winding counter clockwise and it's getting tighter and tighter, them snapped internally(uh oh), but still no indication it wants to leave the housing. any tips?

Sent from my SGH-T989 using AutoGuide.Com Free App
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
246 Posts
okay, got it now. you said "counter counter clockwise" instead of just clockwise, which is the way to go to remove it. hope anyone else who might also get thrown off by that double negative reads this first and doesn't damage anything...

edit: all done. make sure you don't screw that top on backwards or up is down and vice versa. anyway, thanks for the write up. if indeed it's dirty contacts it's an easy enough job but for myself looks like i have maybe a problem with the rubber guides. without window bolted on the track the plate moves up and down easily, until there is a window bolted to it

Sent from my SGH-T989 using AutoGuide.Com Free App
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
108 Posts
Discussion Starter #8
Sorry the photos were out of order I just fixed that issue.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
169 Posts
Adding to this excellent thread.

While removing the 2 screws on the motor, a small rectangular piece of metal fell out. Took me a while to figure out that it’s the nut where the screw bolts into (there are 2 of them).
82786
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
169 Posts
On the window motor body there are 2 connectors that can be unplugged by prying at some catches with a small screwdriver. Then a white plastic assembly holding 2 of the commutator brushes can be pulled out for easier inspection and cleaning. A black gasket also comes off.
82787
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
169 Posts
I checked the thermal switch by putting the 2 leads of a multi-tester on points A and B, and confirmed there was continuity. This indicated that the thermal switch was in the “closed” position (that a current could pass thru it) and appeared to be in good shape.

82789


While cleaning the rotor I thought I had damaged some of the copper cladding. But it seems there is no copper on this portion by design.

82790


During re-assembly, turn the rotor counterclockwise until snug. That is, you shouldn’t be able to pull the rotor out even a little way.

82791


If the rotor is not snug, when you put the stator on, the strong magnets in it may pull at the rotor and misalign the brushes. I suspect that’s what happened on my first re-assembly attempt (when the motor wouldn’t run and I almost threw it away). Edited 7/19/2020 I found out this assumption was wrong. My brushes were already thin and on their way out. [link]

My power window motor and regulator are now operational. Now to try my hand at the broken power window master switch.

Thank you BTSchakert and to everyone on this site for sharing their knowledge on our little car.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
68 Posts
Success at getting the "window regulator assembly (incl. motor)" out of the door well, disassembling the motor--a few times, polishing the contact points, tweaking the "sets" of the brushes (main, and a second set in the back that hasn't been mentioned), cleaning and re-greasing the metal slides with white lithium grease, silicone spraying the window channels for the glass, and putting it all back together.

I've got some pictures of my own to add to the fine set already here.

My driver's window was stuck about an inch and a half from closed (since Nov. the gap has been filled with a stick of pipe insulation packing-taped into place, and traveled 500 miles in that situation through rain and sleet thankyouverymuch). I was able to get to the rearmost of the two screws holding the bottom of the window to the bracket with my too-short ratchet wrench: mine was 5-1/2" overall (an absolute must tool, and longer is better).

The right-hand side was unreachable from the left-side hole, and was worse from the right-hand hole. I'm tall, but by the time I got my hand in there near the bolt I couldn't raise my eyes above the slot to see what I was doing.

Failing to reach that bolt, I took out all the other ones :^p, the 4 on the bracket and the 3 on the motor. That let me tilt the back of the window up and out (outside of the door), and with a partner holding the glass, I was just able to reach the screw from the left-hand holes with two hands' worth of fingers. I could use one set to keep the wrench head on the bolt head and with the other I could peform about 4 degrees worth of ratchet... And the bolts are unnecessarily long...

BUT good news, you don't have to do it the way I did because I have another hare-brained idea about How I'm Going to Do It Next Time.

As you read @BTschakert's starter post above (and we pause here for five minutes of deep thanksgiving...), you'll notice the step about "unscrewing the armature." (I'm not sure if it's clockwise for the passenger-side case, but it is for the driver's side.) If you start doing it the wrong way, aside from noticing it isn't coming out of the case, you may notice that the wee cable is MOVING along the regulator bar. That got me to wondering how-in-the-world one was supposed to get the window to go the opposite direction: because turning the other direction removes the regulator from the case!

Well, of course, that doesn't happen when the case is closed. When it's open there's a slight spring action (from the brushes I suspect) which pushes the armature up slightly--enough to engage the threads to result in unscrewing it out of the case.

I discovered if you PRESS DOWN on the armature (i.e., back into the case) while rotating it in the "removal" direction, the threads DON'T engage and instead, the cable moves in the opposite direction! <cue applause>

Also, when I had all the screws out (but the one I really wanted) and everything was loose, I had noticed that I could swing the motor to the right-hand side access hole. So.

NEXT TIME (for the brushes I saw were worn), if the window is stuck anywhere but the ideal location for removing the two pesky window bolts, I propose to swing the motor to a location where I can remove its cover, and then while leaving the armature IN the motor, chuck the end of it into an electric drill and DRIVE the window whither I will. You could tear up the motor this way, if you wanted to, or you could proceed gently on low speeds and be fine. Doing this press-and-rotation of the armature by hand, I estimate it took about 50-75 full revolutions to get the "platform" from the top to the bottom.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
68 Posts
This picture shows the result of removing all the seven bolts from the window regulator and motor and the rearmost of the two holding the window, allowing the back of the window to be tilted out of the door and up--making the frontmost bolt possibly more accessible but the motor reachable as well.
86353
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
68 Posts
Motor is accessible to try taking cover off and running window down by manually rotating armature.
86358
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
68 Posts
Two sets of brushes (large set in foreground/front, smaller set in back) for the two commutators.

86359
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
68 Posts
Modified-finger sander... (ummm, the over-18 picture warning was not my idea... must've triggered something)
Sensitive content, not recommended for those under 18 Show Content
86360
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
68 Posts
I used the finest emery cloth I had but I should've found something finer. I suspect the rougher surface will wear out what remains of the brushes even quicker. I uthed white lithium greathe. Be thure to put it on the endth too.
86361
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
68 Posts
The motor case bolts go into flat nuts that fit into slots on the back. This pick shows one in its slot (next to the yellow insulation, and one out of its slot (at lower right). @geocougar mentioned being surprised when it just appeared, and I was too. Yours might not fall out.
86362
 
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
Top